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Oil weight

Crild

Drag Race Newbie
Location
Florida
That is pre-catch can, and that corner is where I have logged up to 1.3G peak. Ignore the G sensor in the overlay, it's not accurate.

In the video I'm on:
Uni stage 2 w/ CTS downpipe, stock catback, and Uni intercooler
034 springs -> moved to pss10 coils for this year
034 dynamic + top mounts (-2.3 one side and -2.5 the other)
034 dogbone inserts -> moved to revo puck this year (dramatically better, pain to install)
034 p34 intake -> going back to stock this year
CTS TIP (improved throttle response mid corner)
racingline oil cooler -> will get a bigger exchanger this year
ds2500 front pads, r4s rear -> I cooked the R4s repeatedly (they're garbage and worse than stock rears) moving to Gloc R10/ R8 this year
yoko a052 tires in 235/45/17 on a 17x9 front and 17x8 rear (I got the tires for cheap and the wider front after, so decided to use them anyway) -> will run 255/235 or 255/225 this year, and will most likely move to a non-autocross tire that can handle some more heat. The front end gets too hot too fast compared to rear on these cars (laps 1-2 the car is oversteery, 3-6 neutral, and 7-10 front end too hot).

Everything else is pretty much stock.

Alignment:
c: -2.3/-2.5 F: -1.8 R
toe: 0 F : 0.03 decimal degrees in per side, 0.06 total
Huge side track here but how do you like Unitronic tune?
 

victorofhavoc

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Kansas City
Huge side track here but how do you like Unitronic tune?
So far it has been reliable and the power is progressive. The stock power was like a miata, you could basically just floor it around every corner and be fine. With the tune you actually have to think about how to apply throttle and there's plenty of power to push out of corners. I flash by myself at home, and it's all pretty straight forward. I hate the fact you need an internet connection to flash and that you pay 600$+ for a can tune, but other tuning measures seem to be focused more on power and straight line stuff than response and safety.

Overall I'm pretty happy with it. I keep wanting to go is38 for more top end, but I'm also trying to keep the car a bit lower power for Time Trial purposes. IS38 essentially drops it into the same category as the GTI TCR race car, and that would just be no fun.
 

GTIfan99

Drag Racing Champion
Location
FL
That is pre-catch can, and that corner is where I have logged up to 1.3G peak. Ignore the G sensor in the overlay, it's not accurate.

In the video I'm on:
Uni stage 2 w/ CTS downpipe, stock catback, and Uni intercooler
034 springs -> moved to pss10 coils for this year
034 dynamic + top mounts (-2.3 one side and -2.5 the other)
034 dogbone inserts -> moved to revo puck this year (dramatically better, pain to install)
034 p34 intake -> going back to stock this year
CTS TIP (improved throttle response mid corner)
racingline oil cooler -> will get a bigger exchanger this year
ds2500 front pads, r4s rear -> I cooked the R4s repeatedly (they're garbage and worse than stock rears) moving to Gloc R10/ R8 this year
yoko a052 tires in 235/45/17 on a 17x9 front and 17x8 rear (I got the tires for cheap and the wider front after, so decided to use them anyway) -> will run 255/235 or 255/225 this year, and will most likely move to a non-autocross tire that can handle some more heat. The front end gets too hot too fast compared to rear on these cars (laps 1-2 the car is oversteery, 3-6 neutral, and 7-10 front end too hot).

Everything else is pretty much stock.

Alignment:
c: -2.3/-2.5 F: -1.8 R
toe: 0 F : 0.03 decimal degrees in per side, 0.06 total
Have you maximized neg camber at the 3 mounting bolts for strut top and the slop in the 3 bolts for the ball joint/LCA mounting point? There's more than you'd think.

I'm stg1 OTS cobb 91oct on 93oct fuel, with a square 245mm RE71R set up with -2.4, .02 toe out front and -1.8, .02 toe in rear, APR springs, 26mm rsb, and it handles pretty well. I'm going to slot the upper holes to see if there's a little more neg camber to be had in the front.

I'm wondering at what camber in the front you start to really hamper braking, acceleration?
 
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victorofhavoc

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Kansas City
Have you maximized neg camber at the 3 mounting bolts for strut top and the slop in the 3 bolts for the ball joint/LCA mounting point? There's more than you'd think.
Previously, yes. This time I got the upper dogbone bushing stuck at a slight angle, so i took it to my mechanic and he did the coils at the same time. He knows to give me as much neg camber as possible, so we'll see how I end up with the coils. I still need to go back for a corner balance and alignment.

Also, the PSS10 are so much more comfortable than the 034 springs on DCC shocks. There's significantly more travel, and while they are stiff, they're definitely smooth.

...I really need to start a build thread...
 

Crild

Drag Race Newbie
Location
Florida
So far it has been reliable and the power is progressive. The stock power was like a miata, you could basically just floor it around every corner and be fine. With the tune you actually have to think about how to apply throttle and there's plenty of power to push out of corners. I flash by myself at home, and it's all pretty straight forward. I hate the fact you need an internet connection to flash and that you pay 600$+ for a can tune, but other tuning measures seem to be focused more on power and straight line stuff than response and safety.

Overall I'm pretty happy with it. I keep wanting to go is38 for more top end, but I'm also trying to keep the car a bit lower power for Time Trial purposes. IS38 essentially drops it into the same category as the GTI TCR race car, and that would just be no fun.
I don't understand how you're mad about having to pay for a tune.

I keep thinking if going UNI stage 1+ because I like their own+ philosophy with reliability in mind not all out power. I like the accessport for all the data you can view at a moment's notice but even custom tunes on a Cobb device scare me. You see race reviews on the forums but always people with some form of problem in the specific Facebook groups.
 

Crild

Drag Race Newbie
Location
Florida
Previously, yes. This time I got the upper dogbone bushing stuck at a slight angle, so i took it to my mechanic and he did the coils at the same time. He knows to give me as much neg camber as possible, so we'll see how I end up with the coils. I still need to go back for a corner balance and alignment.

Also, the PSS10 are so much more comfortable than the 034 springs on DCC shocks. There's significantly more travel, and while they are stiff, they're definitely smooth.

...I really need to start a build thread...
You need to do a review on those coils soon so I can think about buying a set
 

victorofhavoc

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Kansas City
I don't understand how you're mad about having to pay for a tune.

I keep thinking if going UNI stage 1+ because I like their own+ philosophy with reliability in mind not all out power. I like the accessport for all the data you can view at a moment's notice but even custom tunes on a Cobb device scare me. You see race reviews on the forums but always people with some form of problem in the specific Facebook groups.
I wouldn't be mad about the cost if I could send them data logs and have adjustments made for my specific vehicle, but that's not the case. You're essentially paying for a basic CANbus to USB cable and a flash file that every single other person runs as well. Sure, the initial development for them likely took a bit of time and fine tuning, but after that it's all profit. 600$ + is definitely excessive, and I'm really not sure why everyone finds that normal. Maybe I'm spoiled coming from the subaru community where I paid 160$ for a CANbus cable, and then 120$ for a "protune" where the tuner made about 15 adjustments with me back and forth, and even after I added stuff, he only charged 30$ for revisions. I went to e85 and he charged me 30$ to make about 7-8 revisions with me.

It is what it is, and clearly since I paid for it I found it to be worthwhile. If I could find a tuner I trust, I wouldn't hesitate to go down the cobb route, but the cobb stock tunes are garbage. I had a Cobb tune on my wrx and the car would stall with me sitting at a red light. Eventually I ended up learning how to tune on the open source platform and did it myself. When things got very complex, I went to a tuner I liked.
 

reverend_sean

Ready to race!
Location
Pittsburgh
I was previously running a JB1 and found the massive torque surge at ~3k rpm horrible for trying to modulate when rolling on the throttle coming out of turns. Instructors would light me up about my throttle application, even if I just breathed on the pedal. I bought a used Cobb for $400 and had Ed at EQT make a low torque tune ($175) for me to help eliminate the large torque surge, but still give me over all more power. I have no dyno charts to show it off, but I feel it is a pretty good combo. I'm still at that $600 mark, but I can resell it to recoup some of the $ down the road. Ed was good about helping me diagnos an issue that was sending my car into limp mode mid-session (IATs were getting too high).
 

morricus

New member
Location
Illinois
I wouldn't be mad about the cost if I could send them data logs and have adjustments made for my specific vehicle, but that's not the case. You're essentially paying for a basic CANbus to USB cable and a flash file that every single other person runs as well. Sure, the initial development for them likely took a bit of time and fine tuning, but after that it's all profit. 600$ + is definitely excessive, and I'm really not sure why everyone finds that normal. Maybe I'm spoiled coming from the subaru community where I paid 160$ for a CANbus cable, and then 120$ for a "protune" where the tuner made about 15 adjustments with me back and forth, and even after I added stuff, he only charged 30$ for revisions. I went to e85 and he charged me 30$ to make about 7-8 revisions with me.

It is what it is, and clearly since I paid for it I found it to be worthwhile. If I could find a tuner I trust, I wouldn't hesitate to go down the cobb route, but the cobb stock tunes are garbage. I had a Cobb tune on my wrx and the car would stall with me sitting at a red light. Eventually I ended up learning how to tune on the open source platform and did it myself. When things got very complex, I went to a tuner I liked.
I agree with you. I'm new to this way of doing things as well. I was spoiled in that I had AMS 20 miles away to tune my Evo. They'd spend almost two hours with it on the dyno, making it perfect for about $500. Even my E46 M3, a car who's tuning costs are insanely high, was remotely dyno tuned. I've never done this canned tune thing before, and I'm spending more time doing my research because of it. I'm not mad about it, but it is somewhat odd to me. I think I'm either going to have GIAC tune it or AMS. I just don't know if AMS can do the same level of DSG tuning that more VW focused tuners offer.
 

victorofhavoc

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Kansas City
I agree with you. I'm new to this way of doing things as well. I was spoiled in that I had AMS 20 miles away to tune my Evo. They'd spend almost two hours with it on the dyno, making it perfect for about $500. Even my E46 M3, a car who's tuning costs are insanely high, was remotely dyno tuned. I've never done this canned tune thing before, and I'm spending more time doing my research because of it. I'm not mad about it, but it is somewhat odd to me. I think I'm either going to have GIAC tune it or AMS. I just don't know if AMS can do the same level of DSG tuning that more VW focused tuners offer.
Personally, I think the DSG tuning is some funny black magic. Does it shift faster? no. Does it shift harder? no. Does it shift more consistently? no. Does it hold more torque? I dunno, maybe? Does it lock you in the gear you select? YES!!! <- And that's all I paid the 600$+ for, nothing else mattered to me.

At the end of the day, all of the flash tunes are going to be basically the same thing. There are difference in power delivery and how they achieve what they achieve, but for the majority of us the lap times will be basically the same. The DSG tune feels like a very expensive flip of a bit in a registry to me, and I'll gladly welcome a tuner to prove me wrong with hard facts, but things like "Ours is better because <blah blah marketing gimmick>" just annoy me. I was ready to drop $4k+ on a set of coils from AST, but they wouldn't give me any more factual, hard data than "our shocks are just that powerful"...Bilstein on the other hand gave me dampening specs, coil thickness, coil metal, coil count, and tons of other data.

This has gone sooooo off topic...alright, I'm finally doing it, here's where I'll do a proper build thread...feel free to ask me anything off topic there:
 

Crild

Drag Race Newbie
Location
Florida
Personally, I think the DSG tuning is some funny black magic. Does it shift faster? no. Does it shift harder? no. Does it shift more consistently? no. Does it hold more torque? I dunno, maybe? Does it lock you in the gear you select? YES!!! <- And that's all I paid the 600$+ for, nothing else mattered to me.

At the end of the day, all of the flash tunes are going to be basically the same thing. There are difference in power delivery and how they achieve what they achieve, but for the majority of us the lap times will be basically the same. The DSG tune feels like a very expensive flip of a bit in a registry to me, and I'll gladly welcome a tuner to prove me wrong with hard facts, but things like "Ours is better because <blah blah marketing gimmick>" just annoy me. I was ready to drop $4k+ on a set of coils from AST, but they wouldn't give me any more factual, hard data than "our shocks are just that powerful"...Bilstein on the other hand gave me dampening specs, coil thickness, coil metal, coil count, and tons of other data.

This has gone sooooo off topic...alright, I'm finally doing it, here's where I'll do a proper build thread...feel free to ask me anything off topic there:
Share that Bilstein info if you would. Shame the spring rates aren't different for the R vs GTI tho
 

victorofhavoc

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Kansas City
Share that Bilstein info if you would. Shame the spring rates aren't different for the R vs GTI tho
most of the details can actually be found on the product manual page:

The rest of the data (like spring rate) can either be calculated or Bilstein will email back. Some of the data they had published on the euro site before, but not on the US site. After I emailed them over a year ago they included it all on the US site as well. The spring rates I posted on the coilover page after calculating.

Why would the spring rates be different for the R? The weight difference of the cars is basically negligible and can be accounted for during corner balance. The chassis is the same and the driveline might be slightly different, but the R is still mostly fwd and acts like it.
 

Crild

Drag Race Newbie
Location
Florida
most of the details can actually be found on the product manual page:

The rest of the data (like spring rate) can either be calculated or Bilstein will email back. Some of the data they had published on the euro site before, but not on the US site. After I emailed them over a year ago they included it all on the US site as well. The spring rates I posted on the coilover page after calculating.

Why would the spring rates be different for the R? The weight difference of the cars is basically negligible and can be accounted for during corner balance. The chassis is the same and the driveline might be slightly different, but the R is still mostly fwd and acts like it.
I wouldn't say 10% or so heavier is negligible
 

victorofhavoc

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Kansas City
I wouldn't say 10% or so heavier is negligible
Spec for spec you're looking at 7.8% difference, and that's considering dry weight. The r adds weight, but it's mostly inside the wheelbase. 3373 vs 3128 dry... Then account for fuel and you're at 7.6% difference. It's definitely a difference but it's not extremely dramatic. My gti with absolutely nothing in it, and fueled up weighs 3166. If you assume similar prep for an r that's 3406. For a 400# spring that would be 430# to be equal. That's a small enough difference that you can account with the shock adjustment. If you were chasing titles and running 1100# springs, then yeah it would make much more of a difference to fine tune the rate, but 99% of people won't notice 430 vs 400.
 

SouthFL_Mk7.5

Go Kart Newbie
Location
South Florida
Ride
2019 GTI S
I was previously running a JB1 and found the massive torque surge at ~3k rpm horrible for trying to modulate when rolling on the throttle coming out of turns. Instructors would light me up about my throttle application, even if I just breathed on the pedal. I bought a used Cobb for $400 and had Ed at EQT make a low torque tune ($175) for me to help eliminate the large torque surge, but still give me over all more power. I have no dyno charts to show it off, but I feel it is a pretty good combo. I'm still at that $600 mark, but I can resell it to recoup some of the $ down the road. Ed was good about helping me diagnos an issue that was sending my car into limp mode mid-session (IATs were getting too high).
I’m using JB4 Map 1 for track days and found modulation to be good on the road course. I did however find that 3k rpm surge to be problematic when I tried an autocross a month a ago (my first time doing an autocross but that surge was a real bother for the low speed maneuvers of the course layout)...
On the street I prefer to use Map 2 because it’s punchy, but George made me a smooth building max boost Map 6 with a lower boost at lower rpm which builds to 7.9 at 5500rpm. He doesn’t recommended that I use that Map 6 on the road course but I m sure he can build a low torque, moderate boost Map 6 for the road course or auto x if asked!

I was interested in Track use of the Unitronic 1+. Interested to see if can run well on the road course on the factory intercooler. If I have to upgrade intercooler I’d just do the Downpipe too and go Stage 2.

To bring thread back on topic I used 5w 40 at Sebring a few months ago with success and will be using it again at Homestead next week. Haven’t really pushed the car hard enough yet to need a catch can, but intend on pushing a little harder next week.
 
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Crild

Drag Race Newbie
Location
Florida
I’m using JB4 Map 1 for track days and found modulation to be good on the road course. I did however find that 3k rpm surge to be problematic when I tried an autocross a month a ago (my first time doing an autocross but that surge was a real bother for the low speed maneuvers of the course layout)...
On the street I prefer to use Map 2 because it’s punchy, but George made me a smooth building max boost Map 6 with a lower boost at lower rpm which builds to 7.9 at 5500rpm. He doesn’t recommended that I use that Map 6 on the road course but I m sure he can build a low torque, moderate boost Map 6 for the road course or auto x if asked!

I was interested in Track use of the Unitronic 1+. Interested to see if can run well on the road course on the factory intercooler. If I have to upgrade intercooler I’d just do the Downpipe too and go Stage 2.

To bring thread back on topic I used 5w 40 at Sebring a few months ago with success and will be using it again at Homestead next week. Haven’t really pushed the car hard enough yet to need a catch can, but intend on pushing a little harder next week.
5w-40 is perfectly fine for track use. Thats the only oil weight I have ever run and everyone I have spoken with says dont bother messing with it and always make sure its a VW approved oil incase anything were to ever happen you would be good.

Uni recommends stage 1+ with their stage 2 DSG tune for track use. You will need an intercooler if you decide to tune with that florida heat. Even here in WI stage 2 R's will heat soak and go into limp mode on the 80+ days at the track.

Catch can is a piece of junk, i wouldn't waste money on one.
 

jimlloyd40

Autocross Newbie
Location
Phoenix
Ride
2018 SE DSG
5w-40 is perfectly fine for track use. Thats the only oil weight I have ever run and everyone I have spoken with says dont bother messing with it and always make sure its a VW approved oil incase anything were to ever happen you would be good.

Uni recommends stage 1+ with their stage 2 DSG tune for track use. You will need an intercooler if you decide to tune with that florida heat. Even here in WI stage 2 R's will heat soak and go into limp mode on the 80+ days at the track.

Catch can is a piece of junk, i wouldn't waste money on one.
Some catch cans are junk. Not the Spulen one. If the OCC doesn't eliminate the PCV valve it's junk.
 

Stija

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Az
Ride
BMW Saab Subaru VW
Subaru custom tunes aren’t as cheap as you’d think nowadays, @victorofhavoc .

As far as catch cans, they are junk until you find out your engine needs one. How often do you empty yours @jimlloyd40 and how much do you find in there when you do? Also what grade oil do you use?
 

victorofhavoc

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Kansas City
Some catch cans are junk. Not the Spulen one. If the OCC doesn't eliminate the PCV valve it's junk.
I've heard people say this a few times, but I've never understood this logic. The pcv works very well until it's flooded with oil, and then it's overwhelmed and passes the gunk to the intake. Why would you remove something that functions perfectly fine 99% of the time? The inline catch cans just collect whatever gunk the pcv would have passed on. By removing the pcv, you're removing a closed loop system, and how does it even affect crank case pressure? Those aftermarket plates most likely don't seal perfectly...and none of them have even close to the amount of baffling that's necessary.

Both types of cans will function to prevent gunk in the intake, but neither actually fixes the problem... They're just bandaids. I'd still take a can over none, but I'd rather have the inline... And ideally the baffled pan is where I'd toss my money...
 
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