GOLFMK8
GOLFMK7
GOLFMK6
GOLFMKV
  • Has your username changed as part of the site merger and want it changed back? If the other version of your username isn't being used, send Gulfer a PM and we can probably fix it for you

Oil weight

jimlloyd40

Autocross Newbie
Location
Phoenix
Ride
2018 SE DSG
Hello all. New to the forum. I have a 2019 GTI which I’m prepping for an HPDE at Sebring in December. Sticker on the front air dam says VW508 00 & SAE 0w20.
After reading above about going slightly heavier, should I use 5w40 instead?
For racing I would use a higher viscosity oil.
 

Crild

Drag Race Newbie
Location
Florida
Hello all. New to the forum. I have a 2019 GTI which I’m prepping for an HPDE at Sebring in December. Sticker on the front air dam says VW508 00 & SAE 0w20.
After reading above about going slightly heavier, should I use 5w40 instead?
perfectly fine. that was the standard untill the 7.5's
 

GTIfan99

Drag Racing Champion
Location
FL
I've been running 5w-40 in my 2019 at the direction of the dealer to solve the stalling issue and have had no issues. I get well above the advertised gas mileage even with heavier oil. I autocross and track the car, so I was going to do the heavier oil anyways.
 

morricus

New member
Location
Illinois
I know this is older, but just trying to prepare my brand new GTI for the track beatings this spring. I'm surprised to see so many people run 10W60. I am familiar with that viscosity from running my E46 M3 in NASA GTS3. I actually moved from 10W60 to Mobil 1 15w50. I can't say it was any better, but performed equally at a far lower cost and is readily available at any autoparts store. Mobil 1 15w50 is an oddball in the Mobil 1 lineup, it actually has large amounts of zinc and phosphorus and shouldn't be used on cars with cats because of it. If you guys are having success with 10w60, 15w50 should be perfert for track day use and a catless downpipe.

For now, without a downpipe and a tune, I'm going to use Castrol 0w40, seems to be a popular choice. Unless anyone feels strongly otherwise, I'm trying to learn as much as I can about these cars and make good long-term decisions.
 

victorofhavoc

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Kansas City
I know this is older, but just trying to prepare my brand new GTI for the track beatings this spring. I'm surprised to see so many people run 10W60. I am familiar with that viscosity from running my E46 M3 in NASA GTS3. I actually moved from 10W60 to Mobil 1 15w50. I can't say it was any better, but performed equally at a far lower cost and is readily available at any autoparts store. Mobil 1 15w50 is an oddball in the Mobil 1 lineup, it actually has large amounts of zinc and phosphorus and shouldn't be used on cars with cats because of it. If you guys are having success with 10w60, 15w50 should be perfert for track day use and a catless downpipe.

For now, without a downpipe and a tune, I'm going to use Castrol 0w40, seems to be a popular choice. Unless anyone feels strongly otherwise, I'm trying to learn as much as I can about these cars and make good long-term decisions.
Honestly, it's all about oil temp and keeping viscosity up. The oil pump likes to work within a specific viscosity, so we have to assume vw engineers chose a specific weight because of specific operating temps. Based on that, if you're tuned or seeing very high oil temps on track, you want to move to a higher weight to keep viscosity in range of what the pump wants. When I moved to a higher viscosity my temps actually went down. I don't have hard data as to why, but my theory has to do with how efficient the pump is with correct viscosity and that it doesn't introduce air as it would with a thinner oil.

Moving to an oil cooler, I went back down in viscosity to match my new temps.

As an aside, I've used various Mobil 1 weights on my wrx and I tried a 5w40 on the gti. On the wrx I had tons of oil burn, found oil trapped in the turbo (where it had seeped out in areas), and my Blackstone results were poor. Moving to a different oil resolved everything (Rotella t6 on the wrx). On the gti my first Blackstone results were poor on Mobil 1. I can't find the sheet right now, but it was high in various contaminants and I did find some oil in the turbo. This was all with street driving on the gti. I had no issues with Castrol 0w40, no issues with amsoil euro 0w40, none with amsoil 0w50, and recently I have used 10w60 and 0w40 from liquimoly (whatever the full synthetic naming is) with "perfect" Blackstone results. All oils except the Mobil 1 were used on track with good success. I especially like the amsoil and liquimoly as a close second.
 

morricus

New member
Location
Illinois
Honestly, it's all about oil temp and keeping viscosity up. The oil pump likes to work within a specific viscosity, so we have to assume vw engineers chose a specific weight because of specific operating temps. Based on that, if you're tuned or seeing very high oil temps on track, you want to move to a higher weight to keep viscosity in range of what the pump wants. When I moved to a higher viscosity my temps actually went down. I don't have hard data as to why, but my theory has to do with how efficient the pump is with correct viscosity and that it doesn't introduce air as it would with a thinner oil.

Moving to an oil cooler, I went back down in viscosity to match my new temps.

As an aside, I've used various Mobil 1 weights on my wrx and I tried a 5w40 on the gti. On the wrx I had tons of oil burn, found oil trapped in the turbo (where it had seeped out in areas), and my Blackstone results were poor. Moving to a different oil resolved everything (Rotella t6 on the wrx). On the gti my first Blackstone results were poor on Mobil 1. I can't find the sheet right now, but it was high in various contaminants and I did find some oil in the turbo. This was all with street driving on the gti. I had no issues with Castrol 0w40, no issues with amsoil euro 0w40, none with amsoil 0w50, and recently I have used 10w60 and 0w40 from liquimoly (whatever the full synthetic naming is) with "perfect" Blackstone results. All oils except the Mobil 1 were used on track with good success. I especially like the amsoil and liquimoly as a close second.
This is good information, thank you. What catch can are you running? I've had limited success with catch cans in the past. I wasn't planning on running one at first, but seems like a lot of you have success, but seems to depend on what brand you're running.
 

victorofhavoc

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Kansas City
This is good information, thank you. What catch can are you running? I've had limited success with catch cans in the past. I wasn't planning on running one at first, but seems like a lot of you have success, but seems to depend on what brand you're running.
The catch can stuff really comes down to a few things:
There are catch cans that replace the pcv system as a whole, and just allow everything vented to end up in the can. These remove the "closed loop" activity of maintaining the crank case pressure, but do keep the vapors from entering the intake and being burned.

There are catch cans that replace the vent-out-to-intake system with a catch can that allow the pcv to do its job, but anything that it vents gets trapped in the can. Most street driven cars complain these cans "don't catch anything". In reality the pcv is effective enough for street driving, but not on track under high G during braking and hard right turns. When the PCV floods, the add-on catch cans work to catch things.

Ideally, a properly baffled oil pan is the most correct solution because it stops oil from ever flooding the pcv in the first place, but the only one out there right now is the iAbed and it's twice the cost of an add-on catch can. I had a lot of oil burn, check engine light, missing cylinders, and other symptoms of pcv flooding all last year. I plan to run an add-on can this year (likely the bfi due to its can location and cheap cost) to see how it goes, but at some point this year I'll go to a baffled pan. A few times I've had a "low oil" warning come on, which i thought might have been due to loss of oil viscosity at temps of 275F+, but after going to 60 weight and having the same issues, I think it has to do with the pickup. I will absolutely not go to slicks without a baffled pan. I've had all of these oiling issues on 200TW tires...admittedly the yoko a052 is a joke to call 200TW, but still not a slick.
 

morricus

New member
Location
Illinois
Oh my. That pan is glorious. I'd much prefer to spend a little extra now on that well-made pan to fix the problem vs a catch can which is within a stones throw of the pan cost anyway. I very much appreciate your insight here. I don't like the idea of spending $600+ on an oil pan, but I like the idea of all the problems you experienced without one even less. And I honestly cannot bring myselft to spend $400 on a can with some hoses on it.

I'm trying to get certain items out of the way first, remove-all-doubt solutions. For instance, not buying coilovers right away, I bought Vorshlag camber plates for the stock struts and will build around them. I see this pan as the engine equivalent to the Vorslag camber plates.
 

Stija

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Az
Ride
BMW Saab Subaru VW
How many of you can see/monitor your oil pressure in real time or logged?
 

victorofhavoc

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Kansas City
Oh my. That pan is glorious. I'd much prefer to spend a little extra now on that well-made pan to fix the problem vs a catch can which is within a stones throw of the pan cost anyway. I very much appreciate your insight here. I don't like the idea of spending $600+ on an oil pan, but I like the idea of all the problems you experienced without one even less. And I honestly cannot bring myselft to spend $400 on a can with some hoses on it.

I'm trying to get certain items out of the way first, remove-all-doubt solutions. For instance, not buying coilovers right away, I bought Vorshlag camber plates for the stock struts and will build around them. I see this pan as the engine equivalent to the Vorslag camber plates.
If you don't do much wrenching yourself, the pan will cost more than double a basic catch can like the BFI one. Since you've raced in GTS3, I expect you know how to properly apply RTV and set a pan without getting it everywhere and risking sucking up the sludge into your oil system.

Honestly, I'd say just go drive the car on track and fix things as you encounter them. I'd dig through the vagcom/obd11 threads to turn down the brake booster, turn of traction control, turn up VAQ pressure, etc. Those electronic changes make a significant difference.
 

victorofhavoc

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Kansas City
i had an obd adapter that could ready it with torque pro. I logged on track once and saw a few dips, but nothing major. That adapter has since broke and I can't find another one that works the same :/. Haven't tried the obd11 to see if it can log that data yet.
How many of you can see/monitor your oil pressure in real time or logged?
 

morricus

New member
Location
Illinois
If you don't do much wrenching yourself, the pan will cost more than double a basic catch can like the BFI one. Since you've raced in GTS3, I expect you know how to properly apply RTV and set a pan without getting it everywhere and risking sucking up the sludge into your oil system.

Honestly, I'd say just go drive the car on track and fix things as you encounter them. I'd dig through the vagcom/obd11 threads to turn down the brake booster, turn of traction control, turn up VAQ pressure, etc. Those electronic changes make a significant difference.
all good advice. I'll prob pull the trigger on the oil pan regardless. Its somewhat ridiculous how excited I can become regarding something like an oil pan. I'll also start investigating the vagcom/obd11 threads tonight. My kids have a swim meet, so I'll have hours of empty time to fill with VW learning time.

I can't believe what a bargain these cars are. I'm blown away by how much performance you get for your $. I have high hopes for this thing
 

victorofhavoc

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Kansas City
all good advice. I'll prob pull the trigger on the oil pan regardless. Its somewhat ridiculous how excited I can become regarding something like an oil pan. I'll also start investigating the vagcom/obd11 threads tonight. My kids have a swim meet, so I'll have hours of empty time to fill with VW learning time.

I can't believe what a bargain these cars are. I'm blown away by how much performance you get for your $. I have high hopes for this thing
They're definitely solid performers, and when you remove the mountains of rear toe in that the VAG accountants made the engineers set, they really love to get tail happy too. Since you mentioned the e46, here's a video of my friend in his e92 chasing me, chasing our friend in his e46. They're both running MCS suspension, and the e46 is caged and fully prepped. The GTI has a good time keeping up. We'll see how much more I can get out of it on coils this year :).
 

GTIfan99

Drag Racing Champion
Location
FL
They're definitely solid performers, and when you remove the mountains of rear toe in that the VAG accountants made the engineers set, they really love to get tail happy too. Since you mentioned the e46, here's a video of my friend in his e92 chasing me, chasing our friend in his e46. They're both running MCS suspension, and the e46 is caged and fully prepped. The GTI has a good time keeping up. We'll see how much more I can get out of it on coils this year :).
What's your set up? Noticed a big puff of oil out the tailpipe at one point. You using a catch can?
 

victorofhavoc

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Kansas City
What's your set up? Noticed a big puff of oil out the tailpipe at one point. You using a catch can?
That is pre-catch can, and that corner is where I have logged up to 1.3G peak. Ignore the G sensor in the overlay, it's not accurate.

In the video I'm on:
Uni stage 2 w/ CTS downpipe, stock catback, and Uni intercooler
034 springs -> moved to pss10 coils for this year
034 dynamic + top mounts (-2.3 one side and -2.5 the other)
034 dogbone inserts -> moved to revo puck this year (dramatically better, pain to install)
034 p34 intake -> going back to stock this year
CTS TIP (improved throttle response mid corner)
racingline oil cooler -> will get a bigger exchanger this year
ds2500 front pads, r4s rear -> I cooked the R4s repeatedly (they're garbage and worse than stock rears) moving to Gloc R10/ R8 this year
yoko a052 tires in 235/45/17 on a 17x9 front and 17x8 rear (I got the tires for cheap and the wider front after, so decided to use them anyway) -> will run 255/235 or 255/225 this year, and will most likely move to a non-autocross tire that can handle some more heat. The front end gets too hot too fast compared to rear on these cars (laps 1-2 the car is oversteery, 3-6 neutral, and 7-10 front end too hot).

Everything else is pretty much stock.

Alignment:
c: -2.3/-2.5 F: -1.8 R
toe: 0 F : 0.03 decimal degrees in per side, 0.06 total
 
Top