Turns out I bought a tuned CPO car

[RuffledJersey]

Good luck - you're resolution is reasonable so let's hope they agree, but you need everything in writing.

That may end up being the sticking point - even if the dealership puts it in writing the critical issue is how airtight, comprehensive, and legally binding their warranty language is.

 

[Salami]

VW can still tell that it was tuned even if you return to stock.

Yep. There is a log in the ECU of every time it's flashed.

APR told me that VW can only tell the ECU was reflashed and how many times but not with what or by who. They are basically operating under the premise that since it wasn't done by VW that it must have been tuned.

Is that incorrect?

 

[mrmatto]

APR told me that VW can only tell the ECU was reflashed and how many times but not with what or by who. They are basically operating under the premise that since it wasn't done by VW that it must have been tuned.

Is that incorrect?

No, everyone's saying the same basic thing: VW knows the ECU has been modified at some point, and that's typically enough to TD1 the car and deny certain warranty claims. Whether it was tuned or not, modifying the ECU is a modification, and so anything related to that can be denied for warranty service.

 

[GTIfan99]

APR told me that VW can only tell the ECU was reflashed and how many times but not with what or by who. They are basically operating under the premise that since it wasn't done by VW that it must have been tuned.

Is that incorrect?

If the number of flashes don't add up to your service history, then they're going to flag the car.

 

[tigeo]

And of course all of this is predicated on the warranty claim requiring backup that requires them to look in the first place (guided flault programming?) - not every warranty claim requires this and is why many folks get things covered that may not seem like they should.

 

[cb1111]

And of course all of this is predicated on the warranty claim requiring backup that requires them to look in the first place (guided flault programming?) - not every warranty claim requires this and is why many folks get things covered that may not seem like they should.

Yes, it is very simple. TD-1 doesn't "void the warranty" - all it does is tell the mothership that the eCU has been modified. It doesn't say how or by whom.

At that point, the computer will ask "could the mod have caused or contributed to this failure?" If the answer is "yes" then the warranty claim is denied.

 

[tigeo]

Yes, it is very simple. TD-1 doesn't "void the warranty" - all it does is tell the mothership that the eCU has been modified. It doesn't say how or by whom.

At that point, the computer will ask "could the mod have caused or contributed to this failure?" If the answer is "yes" then the warranty claim is denied.

That's it in a nutshell but lord have mercy the yarns that are spun on the internet about how this all works...aahahaha

 

[Chogokin]

Yes, it is very simple. TD-1 doesn't "void the warranty" - all it does is tell the mothership that the eCU has been modified. It doesn't say how or by whom.

At that point, the computer will ask "could the mod have caused or contributed to this failure?" If the answer is "yes" then the warranty claim is denied.

Friend of mine has a 4motion wagon thats FBO, JB4 and IS20. He never removed the JB4. VW still replaced his transmission.

The TD1 can be hit or miss. If the damage is bad enough...VW will send out a rep to inspect the damage. They will then decide to warranty the car or not...but yeah...the TD1 isn't an automatic end to your drivetrain warranty.

 

[tigeo]

If you are interested...here's your flash counter. This is using OBDEleven under the engine control unit 01, advanced identification, number of programming attempts. Application 2 is how many times it's been flashed. For me 5 = 1 (stock) + 1 (stage 1+) + 1 (stage 2 IS20) + 1 (stage 2 IS20...reflashed to test something) + 1 (stage 2+ IS38). It incremements up by 1 each time b/c I check it. They are all "1" on a stock car, again, verified. Bootloader and Data Record goe up by 2 each time. Appication 3 stays the same. Application is bootloader less 1 (maybe takes out original 1 but still increments by 2?). I imagine VW's scan tool routine (if they run it) just compares this against how many times they have a record for your ECU being flashed - simple.

 

[Pinche.adam]

VW can still tell that it was tuned even if you return to stock.

Ok that's common knowledge.. my question is how the hell they sold him a tuned car as cpo. Let alone a tuned car that's 6 years old and over 50k miles as cpo

 

[Chogokin]

Ok? But vw never knew the car was tuned....

No...VW won't scan the ECU unless they have a reason to. If he blows his turbo and the dealer contacts VW that they want to replace the turbo...VW might want to see the ECU data. In that situation VW should send out a tech to look at the engine. If he determines that the tune blew the engine...then the repair is on the owner. If he determines that the turbo blew because of a defect...then they'll warranty it.

 

[tigeo]

Ok that's common knowledge.. my question is how the hell they sold him a tuned car as cpo. Let alone a tuned car that's 6 years old and over 50k miles as cpo

That's where I am in this thread - I said it in one of my posts above...CPO is typically a few years old/off lease not well used vehicles like this. I really don't think most dealers even know/think to check for tunes etc. The reasoning is likely just the slim pickin' for used cars and they are so desparate they will sell anything they can and deal with stuff like this later b/c honestly, it's so unlikely to every have an issue.

 

[jimlloyd40]

APR told me that VW can only tell the ECU was reflashed and how many times but not with what or by who. They are basically operating under the premise that since it wasn't done by VW that it must have been tuned.

Is that incorrect?

That's probably correct but it doesn't matter what company flashed the tune VW can still tell and flag your car TD1

 

[jimlloyd40]

Ok that's common knowledge.. my question is how the hell they sold him a tuned car as cpo. Let alone a tuned car that's 6 years old and over 50k miles as cpo

You'll have to ask the dealer that CPO'd the car.

 

[mrmatto]

Ok that's common knowledge.. my question is how the hell they sold him a tuned car as cpo. Let alone a tuned car that's 6 years old and over 50k miles as cpo

The CPO range is up to 7 years and 75k miles. It has pretty much full service history and no issues. Boom CPO qualified.

The problem I have is that the dealer i bought it from is the same dealer who performed the tune in 2018, so they should’ve had a record of that when they pulled the car’s records. So it would seem they carelessly missed it, or willfully omitted it.

Sales manager is talking to the dealership owner tomorrow and will let me know what’s decided as a “make-good.”