I am considering tracking my car in the near future...looking for suggestions/tweaks

[Lord_Flexington]

TCR cars with the sequential gear box use the non-PP rears, and use more rear braking than a stock car due to the increased rear downforce.

So no need to upgrade rear hardware. Rear pads make a big difference for experienced drivers, with mods and tweaks to the ABS, but will make zero difference for a new driver. Money is better spent elsewhere until the rears wear out. If you're progressing quickly, rears will need to be replaced soon enough.

Correct. on what the TCR use. (they also use a BBK that is MASSSSSIVE)

However your point is really subjective on it making zero difference for a new driver.

<- Was new driver and I just spent a weekend helping a new mqb driver get out for the first time.

new rears made a difference and have done so on the few MQB owners I've helped get setup. Its truly noticeable, even going from oem to ebc yellows (rear only, for the love of god don't put them on front lol) the difference stability will be apparent.

It is a fine and excellent choice to spend the money there up front.

As a settling point, if your short on time and just somehow don't have the ability to change your oem rears before your next track day.

You will be "ok", just check your wear.

However you should be 100% looking to change them before your next outing.

To piggyback on this, rear pads definitely won't need to be upgraded if you're on stock suspension. You can really take advantage of a better rear pad once you have stiffer suspension. When the front end isn't diving hard under braking you don't get as much weight transfer off of the rear to the front, so the rear brakes have the ability to do more work. In that case, a stickier rear pad will help slow the car down faster.

So this is both correct and incorrect.

You can be on stock suspension and still benefit from having an upgraded pad setup. This is irrelevant to suspension setup.

If you have a stronger pad on front, your front braking ability will still cause wicked diving regardless of suspension setup. That's just how its going to work. Having a stronger rear will even the diving out.

Better suspension will make a massive difference at speed and will 100% help improve things overall.

You are correct in saying the rear pad will help you slow down faster also you can extend the life of your expensive front pads! They can share the responsibility of braking taking the wear down a peg or two than just having dedicated fronts.

 

[Lord_Flexington]

Thanks. SCDA event in Palmer, MA. Novice group so i get some instruction though I’m not sure exactly what that entails. Any thoughts?

Per SCDA:

Run Group Criteria:

NOVICE is also known as the Green Run Group. ( Newer track drivers with no experience to limited experience, Instructors are required and will be provided for lead follow w/ radio communication.)

Thats perfect! Palmer is a really fun track!

SCDA runs a great group too. So a combination of classroom or track instruction (What corners to watch out for, track etiquette, etc) If they allow it you might ride with an instructor but it seems your going to follow the instructor in your car with a headset and he/she can talk to you while your are following.

It's a pretty fun way to learn a circuit!

 

[up4speed]

I figured I would give an update. I finished setting up the car, and did a track day at Monticello Motor Club (1st track day with my GTI).
The modifications to my stock (non PP) GTI that I decided to do are:
Michelin PS4S tires, Stop Tech Cryogenically treated rotors, Ferodo DS2500 Front Pads, Yellow Stuff rear pads, Motul RF600 brake fluid and Audi RS3 Brake duct scoops.
I was pleasantly surprised that this setup worked VERY well! The brakes worked perfectly. On the long straight I reached speeds up to 105 MPH, and had to brake VERY hard down to approx. 45-50MPH for the S's.
I didn't get any brake fade, nor any vibration after a full day of fun. It was raining during the morning session, but cleared up in the afternoon.
My only concern is the tires. I did approximately 6 to 7, 20 minute sessions for a total of 120 track miles, and the tires seemed to have worn very little (I was trying to be as smooth as possible), BUT.....
On the way home, the tires were very noisy, and it almost felt like the rears were off balance. I was feeling a vibration in the floor, and the seat. The steering and front felt nice and smooth as always, so it seemed isolated to the rear.
I checked the weights to make sure that I didn't fling one off, and it seems like they are all there. Did anyone else notice this happening with these tires after only one or two track days? That was the only disappointing part of the day. They opened the full track after lunch, so on the long straight, I was hitting 122 MPH, and the brakes were still perfectly fine!
Here is a short clip from the GoPro:

 

[Gray_Panther]

I figured I would give an update. I finished setting up the car, and did a track day at Monticello Motor Club (1st track day with my GTI).
The modifications to my stock (non PP) GTI that I decided to do are:
Michelin PS4S tires, Stop Tech Cryogenically treated rotors, Ferodo DS2500 Front Pads, Yellow Stuff rear pads, Motul RF600 brake fluid and Audi RS3 Brake duct scoops.
I was pleasantly surprised that this setup worked VERY well! The brakes worked perfectly. On the long straight I reached speeds up to 105 MPH, and had to brake VERY hard down to approx. 45-50MPH for the S's.
I didn't get any brake fade, nor any vibration after a full day of fun. It was raining during the morning session, but cleared up in the afternoon.
My only concern is the tires. I did approximately 6 to 7, 20 minute sessions for a total of 120 track miles, and the tires seemed to have worn very little (I was trying to be as smooth as possible), BUT.....
On the way home, the tires were very noisy, and it almost felt like the rears were off balance. I was feeling a vibration in the floor, and the seat. The steering and front felt nice and smooth as always, so it seemed isolated to the rear.
I checked the weights to make sure that I didn't fling one off, and it seems like they are all there. Did anyone else notice this happening with these tires after only one or two track days? That was the only disappointing part of the day. They opened the full track after lunch, so on the long straight, I was hitting 122 MPH, and the brakes were still perfectly fine!
Here is a short clip from the GoPro:

Thanks for sharing! I have been following your thread and when the time comes for me to track both my cars, GTI and 128i, I will be following your setup with only one or two differences.
I would just use a dedicated track wheel and tire setup and maybe an RSB upgrade. With a dedicated track wheel I still run street tires for my GTI for when I am not on the track.

 

[tpellegr]

I figured I would give an update. I finished setting up the car, and did a track day at Monticello Motor Club (1st track day with my GTI).
The modifications to my stock (non PP) GTI that I decided to do are:
Michelin PS4S tires, Stop Tech Cryogenically treated rotors, Ferodo DS2500 Front Pads, Yellow Stuff rear pads, Motul RF600 brake fluid and Audi RS3 Brake duct scoops.
I was pleasantly surprised that this setup worked VERY well! The brakes worked perfectly. On the long straight I reached speeds up to 105 MPH, and had to brake VERY hard down to approx. 45-50MPH for the S's.
I didn't get any brake fade, nor any vibration after a full day of fun. It was raining during the morning session, but cleared up in the afternoon.
My only concern is the tires. I did approximately 6 to 7, 20 minute sessions for a total of 120 track miles, and the tires seemed to have worn very little (I was trying to be as smooth as possible), BUT.....
On the way home, the tires were very noisy, and it almost felt like the rears were off balance. I was feeling a vibration in the floor, and the seat. The steering and front felt nice and smooth as always, so it seemed isolated to the rear.
I checked the weights to make sure that I didn't fling one off, and it seems like they are all there. Did anyone else notice this happening with these tires after only one or two track days? That was the only disappointing part of the day. They opened the full track after lunch, so on the long straight, I was hitting 122 MPH, and the brakes were still perfectly fine!
Here is a short clip from the GoPro:

Looks like a fun day out there. Glad the car and brakes performed well. Didn’t realize those front pads were available for the non PP calipers. Interesting about the rear tires. Have not experienced that with the MPSS (which I know are similar). What pressures were you running in rears? Maybe you got some weird wear?

 

[up4speed]

Thanks for sharing! I have been following your thread and when the time comes for me to track both my cars, GTI and 128i, I will be following your setup with only one or two differences.
I would just use a dedicated track wheel and tire setup and maybe an RSB upgrade. With a dedicated track wheel I still run street tires for my GTI for when I am not on the track.

I think I may add a larger RSB for next season since everyone says it’s a must have, and fairly inexpensive.

 

[up4speed]

Looks like a fun day out there. Glad the car and brakes performed well. Didn’t realize those front pads were available for the non PP calipers. Interesting about the rear tires. Have not experienced that with the MPSS (which I know are similar). What pressures were you running in rears? Maybe you got some weird wear?

Yes the front pads were available but not the rear, it’s too bad because I REALLY like them. They impressed me.
As far as tire pressures go, I started with 37 psi front and rear. My reasoning was that I didn’t want the edges to roll too much and destroy the tire too fast. After the first or second session, they were holding up well, but the instructor recommended that we lower the pressure to approximately 35. I did that, and it seems like I had a little better traction, however it also seems like the edges wore a lot more (but in all fairness, I also bumped the speeds up, and the road was drying up). I don’t know if any of that helped create a weird weird pattern. I would like to try to figure it out, because I don’t have dedicated track tire, and it can possibly be annoying. I am actually thinking it was a weird wear pattern because when I left the place it seemed a lot worse than by the time I got home 140 miles away. I am doing another track day on the 24th at lime rock, I guess I can see what happens by the end of that day.

 

[IanCH]

If you like tracking (sounds like you do) and are going to keep doing it then you should just bite the bullet right now and buy a set of track wheels/tires. Those PS4S are too nice to be destroyed at the track.

 

[tpellegr]

Yes the front pads were available but not the rear, it’s too bad because I REALLY like them. They impressed me.
As far as tire pressures go, I started with 37 psi front and rear. My reasoning was that I didn’t want the edges to roll too much and destroy the tire too fast. After the first or second session, they were holding up well, but the instructor recommended that we lower the pressure to approximately 35. I did that, and it seems like I had a little better traction, however it also seems like the edges wore a lot more (but in all fairness, I also bumped the speeds up, and the road was drying up). I don’t know if any of that helped create a weird weird pattern. I would like to try to figure it out, because I don’t have dedicated track tire, and it can possibly be annoying. I am actually thinking it was a weird wear pattern because when I left the place it seemed a lot worse than by the time I got home 140 miles away. I am doing another track day on the 24th at lime rock, I guess I can see what happens by the end of that day.

Gut reaction is that seems high (but I'm no expert). My understanding is that in general, psi should be ~10 lb for every thousand lbs of curb weight.

 

[victorofhavoc]

Yes the front pads were available but not the rear, it’s too bad because I REALLY like them. They impressed me.
As far as tire pressures go, I started with 37 psi front and rear. My reasoning was that I didn’t want the edges to roll too much and destroy the tire too fast. After the first or second session, they were holding up well, but the instructor recommended that we lower the pressure to approximately 35. I did that, and it seems like I had a little better traction, however it also seems like the edges wore a lot more (but in all fairness, I also bumped the speeds up, and the road was drying up). I don’t know if any of that helped create a weird weird pattern. I would like to try to figure it out, because I don’t have dedicated track tire, and it can possibly be annoying. I am actually thinking it was a weird wear pattern because when I left the place it seemed a lot worse than by the time I got home 140 miles away. I am doing another track day on the 24th at lime rock, I guess I can see what happens by the end of that day.

Check zeck hausen, they sell ds2500 for rear as well. The ds2500 is the pad I recommend to anyone looking to keep a dual duty pad. I have not found a better one yet.

Additionally to anyone, as you get faster in this car you find out very quickly that heat is the biggest enemy. Before adding any power or even suspension, I'd focus on fighting heat second. Brakes are obviously first, but then focus on oil temps, water temps, brake temps (those rs3 ducts are not enough eventually), and getting front tire temps under control (front needs to be as wide as possible to absorb the heat).

Also, as someone else mentioned, a catch can is needed, but I wouldn't get any of the ones that replace your whole pcv system. It actually functions well and the catch is only needed for high G situations where the pcv floods with oil. The inline will work just as well. To prevent the issue entirely a baffled oil pan is the right solution. I wouldn't pay 4-500$ for a catch can when you can get the baffled pan for 650$. However, I got the bfi catch can for 200$ and it has been doing okay.

 

[victorofhavoc]

Gut reaction is that seems high (but I'm no expert). My understanding is that in general, psi should be ~10 lb for every thousand lbs of curb weight.

There's a lot to it, and ultimately tire sidewall plays a huge role. By going with a soft sidewall street tire, you need to run more pressure. When going to firmer Street tires, you often go lower pressure because you have more rubber and will build up heat faster. When going to dedicated track tires (not 200tw autox tires), things get funny. Hoosier recommends upwards of 45 and 50 psi for fwd cars, but that all depends on your suspension choices too.

 

[Genegenie]

You may notice some track enthusiasts fit 'racing wheels & tyres' just for track days, some take them to fit at the track, some fit them before leaving home and then replace with 'road wheels & tyres' for regular driving. Either way, track days rule - have fun ....

 

[Gray_Panther]

I think I may add a larger RSB for next season since everyone says it’s a must have, and fairly inexpensive.

This is a great thread for every beginner and you provided a follow up review with some real world experience.

 

[Lord_Flexington]

I figured I would give an update. I finished setting up the car, and did a track day at Monticello Motor Club (1st track day with my GTI).
The modifications to my stock (non PP) GTI that I decided to do are:
Michelin PS4S tires, Stop Tech Cryogenically treated rotors, Ferodo DS2500 Front Pads, Yellow Stuff rear pads, Motul RF600 brake fluid and Audi RS3 Brake duct scoops.
I was pleasantly surprised that this setup worked VERY well! The brakes worked perfectly. On the long straight I reached speeds up to 105 MPH, and had to brake VERY hard down to approx. 45-50MPH for the S's.
I didn't get any brake fade, nor any vibration after a full day of fun. It was raining during the morning session, but cleared up in the afternoon.
My only concern is the tires. I did approximately 6 to 7, 20 minute sessions for a total of 120 track miles, and the tires seemed to have worn very little (I was trying to be as smooth as possible), BUT.....
On the way home, the tires were very noisy, and it almost felt like the rears were off balance. I was feeling a vibration in the floor, and the seat. The steering and front felt nice and smooth as always, so it seemed isolated to the rear.
I checked the weights to make sure that I didn't fling one off, and it seems like they are all there. Did anyone else notice this happening with these tires after only one or two track days? That was the only disappointing part of the day. They opened the full track after lunch, so on the long straight, I was hitting 122 MPH, and the brakes were still perfectly fine!
Here is a short clip from the GoPro:

This is awesome well done mate!

Happy that first day went well. Def check your tire pressure.

I have mine so that coming off track tis right at 36-37 psi. MP4s are super soft so every tire is different.

my Trofeos liked a solid 32psi as a hot temp so it will take some time to find the sweet spot!

I have also left the track without adjusting my psi for the street and that makes for a wicked rough ride.

Im so happy the brakes worked out for you. Keep up the progress!

 

[up4speed]

Check zeck hausen, they sell ds2500 for rear as well. The ds2500 is the pad I recommend to anyone looking to keep a dual duty pad. I have not found a better one yet.

Additionally to anyone, as you get faster in this car you find out very quickly that heat is the biggest enemy. Before adding any power or even suspension, I'd focus on fighting heat second. Brakes are obviously first, but then focus on oil temps, water temps, brake temps (those rs3 ducts are not enough eventually), and getting front tire temps under control (front needs to be as wide as possible to absorb the heat).

Also, as someone else mentioned, a catch can is needed, but I wouldn't get any of the ones that replace your whole pcv system. It actually functions well and the catch is only needed for high G situations where the pcv floods with oil. The inline will work just as well. To prevent the issue entirely a baffled oil pan is the right solution. I wouldn't pay 4-500$ for a catch can when you can get the baffled pan for 650$. However, I got the bfi catch can for 200$ and it has been doing okay.

I checked Zeckhausen, and they only show Ferodo pads for the front as well. I have the standard brakes. If I had the PP brakes, then the rears are also available.