First Car Purchase: 2018 VW Golf 1.8T vs 2019 VW Golf 1.4T (both used)

[golfdave]

This. Not really even worth it to tune the 1.4.

1.8 all day. Unless your reason for buying the car is to hypermile every last bit of mpg's out of your long boring commute, the 1.4 is punchy and fuel efficient but gutless. The 1.4 has very little tuning potential as well.

The fwd 1.8 will get still be very fuel efficient (30+mpgs) but the tuning potential is far greater should you choose to bump the power up down the line.

For starters which 1.4lt??....122/125PS or 140/150PS??

The 1.4lt can be tuned to 240BHP
Stage 3 Tuning Kit for 1.4 TSI EA211 240 HP (rtmgperformance.com)

There are people running IS20 turbos
VW Golf 7 1.4TSI 140hp CPTA – Stage3 IS20 turbo kit 98RON – eTuners

One of the threads in the EA211 specific forum subsections of Vortex ...people tuning & making their own adaptor plates
EA211 1.4TURBO (Turbo owners that remapped) | Page 7 | VW Vortex - Volkswagen Forum

I'm running circa 190BHP & 312Nm with a stage 1-B (98RON) Revo map, & modified CAI......& its certainly NOT gutless!.....

I looked at the 1.8lt engine in another MQB platform car, but it had the same MQ250 manual gearbox as the 1.4lt...which is the weak link (the DQ250 DSG is stronger & easier to get reinforced clutch plates for)...so what's the point in carrying around a heavier nose weight & have worst petrol consumption? I get around 43 to 48MPG (UK)..seen it as high as 52MPG & as low as 38MPG on long runs..depending on the route & how heavy the right foot is!

 

[OLD MEN RULE]

I'd go with the 1.8T. As long as it has been well maintained. And has FSH.

 

[luke23]

For starters which 1.4lt??....122/125PS or 140/150PS??

The 1.4lt can be tuned to 240BHP
Stage 3 Tuning Kit for 1.4 TSI EA211 240 HP (rtmgperformance.com)

There are people running IS20 turbos
VW Golf 7 1.4TSI 140hp CPTA – Stage3 IS20 turbo kit 98RON – eTuners

One of the threads in the EA211 specific forum subsections of Vortex ...people tuning & making their own adaptor plates
EA211 1.4TURBO (Turbo owners that remapped) | Page 7 | VW Vortex - Volkswagen Forum

I'm running circa 190BHP & 312Nm with a stage 1-B (98RON) Revo map, & modified CAI......& its certainly NOT gutless!.....

I looked at the 1.8lt engine in another MQB platform car, but it had the same MQ250 manual gearbox as the 1.4lt...which is the weak link (the DQ250 DSG is stronger & easier to get reinforced clutch plates for)...so what's the point in carrying around a heavier nose weight & have worst petrol consumption? I get around 43 to 48MPG (UK)..seen it as high as 52MPG & as low as 38MPG on long runs..depending on the route & how heavy the right foot is!

appreciate the response! I am not sure which 1.4T but it has I think 147hp and 184tq. I would probably only do stage 1 as I want to stay at 87 octane

Stage 1 APR Tune 1.8 T = 267TQ and 223HP (both are crank and at 87 octane)

Stage 1 APR Tune 1.4T = 255TQ and 173HP (both are crank and at 87 octane)

I think I just answered my own question lmao. Thanks again.

 

[luke23]

I'd go with the 1.8T. As long as it has been well maintained. And has FSH.

appreciate it

 

[golfdave]

appreciate the response! I am not sure which 1.4T but it has I think 147hp and 184tq. I would probably only do stage 1 as I want to stay at 87 octane

Stage 1 APR Tune 1.8 T = 267TQ and 223HP (both are crank and at 87 octane)

Stage 1 APR Tune 1.4T = 255TQ and 173HP (both are crank and at 87 octane)

I think I just answered my own question lmao. Thanks again.

Whats the gearboxes on both cars??....if its the same manual or even the same DSG (DQ250) then you can't tune as much..

 

[luke23]

Whats the gearboxes on both cars??....if its the same manual or even the same DSG (DQ250) then you can't tune as much..

i would buy auto. 2018 has 6 speed and 2019 has 8 speed. i apologize but i dont know the exact named for them

 

[golfdave]

i would buy auto. 2018 has 6 speed and 2019 has 8 speed. i apologize but i dont know the exact named for them

8 speed??....new to me I know there's 6 & 7 speed DSG...(dual clutch electrohydraulic manual - not a torque convertor auto)

My point being that if the 1.8lt has a stronger gearbox than the 1.4lt go for the 1.8lt don't just go for the bigger engine regardless.

Over here we hardly get the 1.8lt..its 1.4lt & then 2lt GTI. However there is a 1.8lt in a Skoda Mk3 Octavia (similar to the Golf Estate)..& it came with the same weaker manual gearbox as fitted to the 1.4lt as the 1.8lt engine was limited to 250Nm (same as 1.4lt)..so there was no point in buying the bigger & heavier 1.8lt engine as you are still restricted by the weaker gearbox from the 1.4lt.

 

[Dog Dad Wagon]

8 speed??....new to me I know there's 6 & 7 speed DSG...(dual clutch electrohydraulic manual - not a torque convertor auto)

My point being that if the 1.8lt has a stronger gearbox than the 1.4lt go for the 1.8lt don't just go for the bigger engine regardless.

Over here we hardly get the 1.8lt..its 1.4lt & then 2lt GTI. However there is a 1.8lt in a Skoda Mk3 Octavia (similar to the Golf Estate)..& it came with the same weaker manual gearbox as fitted to the 1.4lt as the 1.8lt engine was limited to 250Nm (same as 1.4lt)..so there was no point in buying the bigger & heavier 1.8lt engine as you are still restricted by the weaker gearbox from the 1.4lt.

Yeah Dave the NAR Golfs don’t get DSGs besides the 4Motion Wagons. NAR Golfs w/ 1.8T get 6-speed torque converter auto, while 1.4T get 8-speed TQ converter

 

[jaypoto]

Yeah Dave the NAR Golfs don’t get DSGs besides the 4Motion Wagons. NAR Golfs w/ 1.8T get 6-speed torque converter auto, while 1.4T get 8-speed TQ converter

Additionally, 1.4 aftermarket/tuning support is very slim here in the states as I said earlier in my post. Other markets are certainly different.

 

[golfdave]

Yeah Dave the NAR Golfs don’t get DSGs besides the 4Motion Wagons. NAR Golfs w/ 1.8T get 6-speed torque converter auto, while 1.4T get 8-speed TQ converter

Old torque convertors?? & no DSGs?? unless AWD??....new to me!!

Since launch in late 2013, in Europe (not just UK) its DSG & manual options for all MK7 trim specs (S, SE, SE-Nav, GT, R-line, GTI(hatch only) GTD, R, for hatch or GSW) only exceptions were the following:-

R estate which was DSG only.
Alltrack 2lt 184PS GTD engine was DSG only,
Alltrack 2lt 150PS engine was manual only
1.6lt 90PS diesel estate was manual only
1lt 85PS petrol hatch & estate was manual only


We didn't get any old school torque convertors....& we didn't get AWD unless Alltrack or R spec & no 1.8lt in Golf....all as per Europe....NAR has its own trim/combination specs dictated to by your market conditions. However I was surprised you still get get loads of old school torque convertors on European brand cars (yes I know its made in Mexico)

Additionally, 1.4 aftermarket/tuning support is very slim here in the states as I said earlier in my post. Other markets are certainly different.

You said :- the 1.4 is punchy and fuel efficient but gutless. The 1.4 has very little tuning potential as well.

Considering many people buy stuff from around the world, if you are determined then there's no stopping somebody from ordering stuff from abroad..plenty on Vortex forums are doing this to their 1.4lt, & a stage 3 kit proves it has good tuning potential...

As for it being "gutless"...mine wasn't not even from the factory...& I have drive numerous GTI & R models "fast" down our twisty back roads, so I know how the 1.4lt compares....maybe if you're straight line racing & using 90MPH+ speeds & comparing to a tuned 2lt in a GTI or R, but otherwise its pretty good.

I was just placing correct info & trying to highlight that the limiting factor might be the gearbox, if the gearbox is stronger on the 1.8lt go for it...

 

[jaypoto]

Considering many people buy stuff from around the world, if you are determined then there's no stopping somebody from ordering stuff from abroad..plenty on Vortex forums are doing this to their 1.4lt, & a stage 3 kit proves it has good tuning potential...

As for it being "gutless"...mine wasn't not even from the factory...& I have drive numerous GTI & R models "fast" down our twisty back roads, so I know how the 1.4lt compares....maybe if you're straight line racing & using 90MPH+ speeds & comparing to a tuned 2lt in a GTI or R, but otherwise its pretty good.

I was just placing correct info & trying to highlight that the limiting factor might be the gearbox, if the gearbox is stronger on the 1.8lt go for it...

Not to argue with you Golfdave but context here is important. The op is a first time new car buyer with little knowledge of the platform. Do you really think he’s going to go through the hoops to try and tune a platform that is not supported like the 1.8 here in North America? The 1.8 here has a reliable well established upgrade path to double the horsepower if you choose to do it. Can't say that about the 1.4 at least here in North America.

Additionally I'm sure your 1.4 is great where you live in the UK. Our roads are massive with huge highways, passing power is something that might be important to consider.

At the end of the day it's up to the op to decide what's more important to him - being able to tune a well established platform reliably with over 300hp (the auto slush box can handle it) vs wanting something more fuel efficient for commuting.

 

[golfdave]

Not to argue with you Golfdave but context here is important. The op is a first time new car buyer with little knowledge of the platform. Do you really think he’s going to go through the hoops to try and tune a platform that is not supported like the 1.8 here in North America? The 1.8 here has a reliable well established upgrade path to double the horsepower if you choose to do it. Can't say that about the 1.4 at least here in North America.

Additionally I'm sure your 1.4 is great where you live in the UK. Our roads are massive with huge highways, passing power is something that might be important to consider.

At the end of the day it's up to the op to decide what's more important to him - being able to tune a well established platform reliably with over 300hp (the auto slush box can handle it) vs wanting something more fuel efficient for commuting.

You've missed my main point again......

The reason I stated what I did is that the OP had to make certain that the gearbox (auto or whatever) in the 1.8LT was stronger than the one fitted to the 1.4lt.....otherwise what's the point of having the bigger 1.8lt engine "IF" it is fitted with the same weaker gearbox as fitted to the 1.4lt?...this being the limiting factor in any tuning!

As for the 1.4lt, is over in NAR more now (Jetta for example) as in many other VAG cars....& getting parts via the web is easy & will get easier in NAR.

As for "passing power"...as I said mines fine upto 90MPH comparing to other standard Golfs be they R32/GTI etc that I have driven.....speed limits are 60mph & 70mph on the motorways...not had a problem overtaking trucks doing 60mph on a motorway...

The 140/150PS 1.4lts from factory have 184lbft available from 1500rpm to 3500rpm.....torque counts....& 138BHP from 4500-6000rpm.

Remember that the 1.8 R4 20vT (EA113/EA827) (Audi TT, Golf GTI Mk4, etc)., might have started as low as 148BHP but only had 155lbft......& to get more than 184lbft you had to have the 207, 222, 237BHP versions these fitted to the TT, S3 & Cupra R or TT quattro sport...

The Revo Stage 1-B remap, is how it should have been mapped as this alters the timing for the fuel, allows the the fuel pump to use all its pressure (factory map strangles it), & only increases the boost (actually delays the opening of the wastegate) a small amount. Result is more bhp & torque across those same rpm ranges as they make it feel factory.


To finish:- If the OP is certain that the 1.8lt has the stronger gearbox then that's fine get the 1.8lt....Over here the other 1.8lt MQB platform cars are fitted with the same gearbox from the 1.4lt...so no point (over here) in having the 1.8lt as tuning is severely limited by the gearbox....might as well get the 1.4lt & have better fuel economy & a lighter nose weight which is better for handling on twisty roads...

 

[RobertJG25]

For what its worth, here's some numbers that don't quite makes sense to me (for NAR cars) that I've seen online:
1.8 w/6speed auto - 170hp / 199 trq -- 0-60 in 7.6 seconds
1.4 w/8speed auto - 147hp / 184 trq -- 0-60 in 7.7 seconds

Can someone explain to me how this is possible? I have the 1.4t auto and the first two gears are very short...but I don't think that makes up the power difference after that.

Was the 1.8t possibly being rated with 91 aki instead of 87 like the 1.4t? I decided to use 93 in my own car and verified via Carista I was making 170hp at 5000rpm with no tune, just 93 instead of 87. I wish every brand rated their engine's power with various octanes like Mazda does with their 2.5t.. (250hp w/93 vs 227hp w/87)

 

[Dents27]

For what its worth, here's some numbers that don't quite makes sense to me (for NAR cars) that I've seen online:
1.8 w/6speed auto - 170hp / 199 trq -- 0-60 in 7.6 seconds
1.4 w/8speed auto - 147hp / 184 trq -- 0-60 in 7.7 seconds

Can someone explain to me how this is possible? I have the 1.4t auto and the first two gears are very short...but I don't think that makes up the power difference after that.

Was the 1.8t possibly being rated with 91 aki instead of 87 like the 1.4t? I decided to use 93 in my own car and verified via Carista I was making 170hp at 5000rpm with no tune, just 93 instead of 87. I wish every brand rated their engine's power with various octanes like Mazda does with their 2.5t.. (250hp w/93 vs 227hp w/87)

No my old 2016 1.8T was 87 gas.

 

[RobertJG25]

No my old 2016 1.8T was 87 gas.

Do you remember if in the owners manual it said "stated horsepower and torque figures were rated with premium gas" or something like that? In mine it says that for the GTI and R