I'm hearing mixed opinions about APR.

[ZuMBLe]

I have now had all three stages of Apr maps on this car. If I would do it over again I'd go custom Cobb protune for sure. With that being said my is38 Apr full send map (catless) has rolled up custom tuned cars with slightly less mods.

They make the most power undoubtedly of any ots tuners. They also have the most research and money put into them. Apr maps have three safety buffers (they are stupidly safe maps, you just hear more about them because they dwarf the other tuners 10 to 1)

1) Lack of aggressive middle range timing. You'll only see 2-7* where it counts even on ethanol.
2) Richer AFRs
3) Oem like ecu adjustments

Two things that are critical to apr or other ots maps to get the most out of them:
1) IATs low, low low low. This is how RJ is able to set is38 records with an ots tune (great ic, pipes, meth, etc.)
2) Fuel has to be over 93 Oct or you will knock. Guaranteed.

Fuel over 93 Oct? That doesn't seem right. APR makes 87, 91, 93, and 100 octane tunes.

 

[Hoon]

They're riding the knock sensors all the time @ the recommended octane level.

 

[launchd]

Do you mean 91 Oct? Or is it just impossible to run without knocking on pump gas?

I fuel with 93 octane - gas stations near me have it

But I'm not sure knocking occurs if you don't use 93+ octane gas with tunes (APR or otherwise), I'm skeptical of that statement.

 

[russiankid]

With a JB4 you can have lots of fun and then have some resale value for the unit when you get rid of the car.

 

[ZuMBLe]

They're riding the knock sensors all the time @ the recommended octane level.

Dang. Good thing I got a 91 tune but put in 93.

 

[Hoon]

Dang. Good thing I got a 91 tune but put in 93.

It's not unique to APR, some of the pro-tunes and most of the OTS tunes are running with slight timing retard from the knock sensors.

The ECUs are so damn good it typically doesn't hurt anything unless you WAY over command, have bad gas, etc. Even then they usually adapt just fine.

Running with 1-2 degrees of knock has always made more power than a clean tune on my car...I just choose not to do it because the last 5% belongs to the gods of speed.

 

[ZuMBLe]

Lots of the JB4 guys also tune to the point where there is slight timing retard. I'd love to see back to back dyno graphs showing how much benefit there is to this. I'm not looking for the most power possible, I just want reliable and repeatable power.

It's not unique to APR, some of the pro-tunes and most of the OTS tunes are running with slight timing retard from the knock sensors.

The ECUs are so damn good it typically doesn't hurt anything unless you WAY over command, have bad gas, etc. Even then they usually adapt just fine.

Running with 1-2 degrees of knock has always made more power than a clean tune on my car...I just choose not to do it because the last 5% belongs to the gods of speed.

 

[gregsju29]

APR stage 2, love it. Have had APR tunes in various forms on 3 GTI's, 1 passat, and one Jetta TDI. Have done the k04 mk6 GTI turbo upgrade with APR, no issues. Have run their runes for 65,000+ miles and have had no issues. There's plenty of options out there, but I have no reason to go elsewhere

 

[Twist1]

They're riding the knock sensors all the time @ the recommended octane level.

This. If you're going to try to actually be even semi quick with Apr and safe your octane should be 20 pts over your tunes octane at all times.

For example, 91 octane run 93 , 93 octane run e25/96

 

[Twist1]

I fuel with 93 octane - gas stations near me have it

But I'm not sure knocking occurs if you don't use 93+ octane gas with tunes (APR or otherwise), I'm skeptical of that statement.

It fkn absolutely occurs my man. Do you have logging software? Put in 91 on a 93 Oct aggressive pump tune like apr and watch all those negative numbers fly. Sensors will be 1.2V by the time u hit 4krpm

APRs is38 catless map is full send it boii and you better make sure that gas is good to go. The ecu is good enough to pull timing if you don't but is not something you'd want to risk consistently

 

[Handguns4heaRTs]

I just choose not to do it because the last 5% belongs to the gods of speed.

This is a great line. Thank you for that haha.

 

[Wazzu70]

It fkn absolutely occurs my man. Do you have logging software? Put in 91 on a 93 Oct aggressive pump tune like apr and watch all those negative numbers fly. Sensors will be 1.2V by the time u hit 4krpm

APRs is38 catless map is full send it boii and you better make sure that gas is good to go. The ecu is good enough to pull timing if you don't but is not something you'd want to risk consistently

Wouldn’t that be expected when putting 91 octane in with a 93 octane tune? Obviously the tune for a specific fuel is intended to be with that fuel or better.

If you have a 91 octane tune and put in 91 octane fuel are you still riding the KS threshold?

 

[GTI Jake]

It depends on one’s definition of reliable. Reliable as in no hiccups and car starts and goes? Or reliable as in 100k problem free miles?

I’ve logged 70k so far APR tuned, stage 2 FBO.

Zero issues.


They’re definitely reliable, and anyone who says otherwise is just trying to sell you on going slow with Unitronic.

Yes, you can make more power with a pro tune via Cobb or others, but for a set it and forget it tune APR is both solid reliable as well as fairly aggressive. Boost don’t hurt these engines, poor tuning (knock) does. APR knows their shit, which is why they tune more cars 10:1 vs all of the competition combined

Just don’t be the guy who does just a downpipe and stage 2 tune then wonders why you don’t get the best results. A quality intercooler, mounts, tires, plugs, and maintenance are key to making good safe power. Everything else is kinda optional, but it you can’t keep it cool and get it to the ground you’re wasting time & money

 

[Jedimk7]

I’ve logged 70k so far APR tuned, stage 2 FBO.

Zero issues.


They’re definitely reliable, and anyone who says otherwise is just trying to sell you on going slow with Unitronic.

Yes, you can make more power with a pro tune via Cobb or others, but for a set it and forget it tune APR is both solid reliable as well as fairly aggressive. Boost don’t hurt these engines, poor tuning (knock) does. APR knows their shit, which is why they tune more cars 10:1 vs all of the competition combined

Just don’t be the guy who does just a downpipe and stage 2 tune then wonders why you don’t get the best results. A quality intercooler, mounts, tires, plugs, and maintenance are key to making good safe power. Everything else is kinda optional, but it you can’t keep it cool and get it to the ground you’re wasting time & money

You could have made your point just as well without bashing unitronic guys[emoji41][emoji106]

Sent from my Gavin Belson black box signature edition

 

[ZuMBLe]

You could have made your point just as well without bashing unitronic guys[emoji41][emoji106]

Sent from my Gavin Belson black box signature edition

Not when he's trying to make a point about being fast....

I just had a few pulls with a 06 STI in Mexico. I'm not sure the STI was properly modded, but my APR Alltrack pulled from him HARD.