You keep using UHP instead of Max or Extreme performance Summer tires which is what most enthusiasts would purchase. There is no comparison between A/S and Winter tires. You simple refuse to accept that TR's data shows that you are wrong. Continental's explanation makes it quite clear that A/S tires are a compromise and not equal to the best Summer or Winter tires.
7
New Wheels going on soon - get summers or stay with all seasons?
- Thread starter caleb.mk7
- Start date
Shane_Anigans
Drag Race Newbie
- Location
- SE MI
- Car(s)
- 2017 GTI Sport DSG
Ohhhh, I see what you're saying: tire manufacturers spend billions of dollars on engineering and manufacturing UHP A/S tires, only to turn around and tell us on their very own websites that they're not as good as summer tires, so that those of us who are easily fooled will buy the summer tires instead. How clever.
DiscusInferno
Go Kart Newbie
- Location
- Kalifornia
Yet, people that buy the legendary Continental ExtremeContact DWS (06) believes it is a true all-season. Fine in the summer and don't need actual winter tires in the winter.
Dan00Hawk
Go Kart Newbie
- Location
- Plainfield, IL
My opinion is more valid than your opinion. So much so that I am going to bold my comments to make even more impact! 
As long as people realize that every tire has some sort of compromise, and that they need to select the tires that best fits their needs. For some folks, an all season is the best compromise. For others, switching between winter and summer is best.
Basic summary of everything out there in the tire world:
All seasons will typically have more grip in cold conditions than a summer tire.
All seasons will typically have more grip in warm conditions than a winter tire.
Summer tires will typically have more grip in warm conditions than an all season.
Winter tires will typically have more grip in cold conditions than an all season.
As long as people realize that every tire has some sort of compromise, and that they need to select the tires that best fits their needs. For some folks, an all season is the best compromise. For others, switching between winter and summer is best.
Basic summary of everything out there in the tire world:
All seasons will typically have more grip in cold conditions than a summer tire.
All seasons will typically have more grip in warm conditions than a winter tire.
Summer tires will typically have more grip in warm conditions than an all season.
Winter tires will typically have more grip in cold conditions than an all season.
Despite the arguing Continental's summary on tires makes it pretty clear what the truth is on tire performance for a given application. It should not be terribly difficult for people to figure out what works for them.
Bold type is sometimes necessary to focus one's attention on a specific point. It's easier than beating someone over the head with a baseball bat.
Ignoring the points being made doesn't change the facts or test results. Tire Rack has a tremendous volume of tire test data showing how A/S tires perform compared to dedicated Max and Extreme Summer tires as well as top rated Winter tires. You don't even need to look at the data you can just watch the test videos and see for yourself exactly what Continental has advised in their tire summary is true.
If you want the best tire performance and traction then you need to purchase the appropriate tires. If you're satisfied with good but not the best tire performance then an A/S might work for you if you do not get any real cold weather, ice and snow. If you get Winter then quality Winter tires could literally save your life by being able to stop and turn in a much shorter distance than A/S tires.
I hope the OP has more than enough info. to make an informed decision. If not he should spend some time at TR viewing the test videos especially on ice if he gets Winter conditions.
Bold type is sometimes necessary to focus one's attention on a specific point. It's easier than beating someone over the head with a baseball bat.
Ignoring the points being made doesn't change the facts or test results. Tire Rack has a tremendous volume of tire test data showing how A/S tires perform compared to dedicated Max and Extreme Summer tires as well as top rated Winter tires. You don't even need to look at the data you can just watch the test videos and see for yourself exactly what Continental has advised in their tire summary is true.
If you want the best tire performance and traction then you need to purchase the appropriate tires. If you're satisfied with good but not the best tire performance then an A/S might work for you if you do not get any real cold weather, ice and snow. If you get Winter then quality Winter tires could literally save your life by being able to stop and turn in a much shorter distance than A/S tires.
I hope the OP has more than enough info. to make an informed decision. If not he should spend some time at TR viewing the test videos especially on ice if he gets Winter conditions.
snobrdrdan
former GTI owner
- Location
- Southeast Michigan
And all seasons will typically have a longer tread life
(shorter with summer & winter tires)
Potentially but not necessarily in regards to Summer tires depending on compound, tread design, etc. but obviously more than a soft compound Winter tire that grips properly on ice and slow.
DiscusInferno
Go Kart Newbie
- Location
- Kalifornia
What summer tire is available with a UTQG wear rating of 500 minimum for the GTI sizes?
The closest I know is the Dunlop Direzza DZ102 at 440. Is it going to grip the road like a Michelin PS4? No. That's a compromise you need to make when you choose a longer wearing summer tire.
The Nitto SN2 studless winter tire is the actual longest wearing winter tires I have ever used, and I put around 10,000 miles in the winter on those tires, I do look forward to getting rid of them for some Nokian WR G4's, but I think these can stretch to a 4th winter season. Michelin Xice Xi3 have a treadlife warranty of 40,000 miles.
Cptnjosh
Go Kart Newbie
- Location
- Kentuckiana
- Car(s)
- 2017 Sport
Michelin pilot A/S 3+ vs Summer tires
Here is an interesting article on the subject at hand:
https://www.minimumtread.com/michelin-pilot-sport-as-3-plus-review.html
I own this Michelin tire and have been very pleased with it. The wet and dry traction are excellent, ( Not PS4 excellent), but probably on the same level as a tier 2 summer tire. The below freezing traction is great. They warm up great, and I feel confident in light snow.
For me, tire choice is mostly about location and finances. I am in the Louisville, KY area. If I was 100 miles to the north, the calculus would change a bit. I have to be at work on time every day. I commute about 17mi each way with a mixture of b roads and state hwy and interstate. We had snow on the roads 4 mornings this winter. Usually it was reasonably cleaned up by the evening commute home. Hardly a reason to invest in a 2nd set of wheels and tires, or run dedicated summers and winter setups. The Michelins leave little on the table for wet and dry traction. Good treadware, not that noisy, light snow traction, and high performance traits make this a very good all arounder. They are perfect for my needs. This is not the case with many a/s though.
Now if you live furhter to the north or in a mountain region it is without a doubt a good idea to run dedicated sets of tires. Any area that receives consistent snowfall for multiple days in a row.
Southern residents should probably just use summers.
So, in short, everyone is correct.
To the OP. Being in Denver, I would probably be inclined to run dedicated sets if it were me. But if money is a consideration then the Conti DWS 06, or the Michelin A/S 3+ would probably fit the the bill for a year round tire.
Here is an interesting article on the subject at hand:
https://www.minimumtread.com/michelin-pilot-sport-as-3-plus-review.html
I own this Michelin tire and have been very pleased with it. The wet and dry traction are excellent, ( Not PS4 excellent), but probably on the same level as a tier 2 summer tire. The below freezing traction is great. They warm up great, and I feel confident in light snow.
For me, tire choice is mostly about location and finances. I am in the Louisville, KY area. If I was 100 miles to the north, the calculus would change a bit. I have to be at work on time every day. I commute about 17mi each way with a mixture of b roads and state hwy and interstate. We had snow on the roads 4 mornings this winter. Usually it was reasonably cleaned up by the evening commute home. Hardly a reason to invest in a 2nd set of wheels and tires, or run dedicated summers and winter setups. The Michelins leave little on the table for wet and dry traction. Good treadware, not that noisy, light snow traction, and high performance traits make this a very good all arounder. They are perfect for my needs. This is not the case with many a/s though.
Now if you live furhter to the north or in a mountain region it is without a doubt a good idea to run dedicated sets of tires. Any area that receives consistent snowfall for multiple days in a row.
Southern residents should probably just use summers.
So, in short, everyone is correct.
To the OP. Being in Denver, I would probably be inclined to run dedicated sets if it were me. But if money is a consideration then the Conti DWS 06, or the Michelin A/S 3+ would probably fit the the bill for a year round tire.
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Gogo GTI
Go Kart Champion
- Location
- Boulder, CO
- Car(s)
- 2017 GTI Sport
Im new to Colorado and got my first set of winter wheels with Michelin X ice. Snow wasnt too bad this season (not sure if this is typical) but it sure does get icy out here. And I was sure as hell glad I had winter tires when it snowed especially with that last cyclone bomb thing. I skidded twice with the X Ice. Im sure I would have spun out in the wrong direction with the stock bridgestone potenza AS. Those were not the most confident feeling tires. The feeling of added safety is priceless for me.
Personally changing wheels is not a big deal for me. It’s further good bonding time with the car.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Personally changing wheels is not a big deal for me. It’s further good bonding time with the car.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
What UHP A/S tire has a 500 UTQG rating?
How many enthusiasts are buying 500 UTQG rated tires?
Last edited:
What UHP A/S tire has a 500 UTQG rating?
https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tire...odel=Pilot+Sport+A/S+3++(W-+or+Y-Speed+Rated)
I am, and there are a lot of other folks on here using them as well. A good performing tire doesn't need to wear out quickly...
The other big advantage (for me at least) is that they retain their wet handling deeper into their tread life. This was my big problem with both the Ventus V12's and the Firehawks. 10-15 K in and the wet traction got downright scary on both of them.
You realize that the UTQG rating is subject to interpretation right and an estimate often used to sell tires? You can't even compare the ratings from one brand to another so perhaps a 440 rating for a Dunlop is equal to a 500 for a Michelin. In addition the rating is based on a rather non-realistic test created by the DOT which is why it proves to be very inconsistent between user experience and test results.
Quote from the TR website:
Unfortunately, the rating that is of the most interest to consumers is the one that appears to be the least consistent. While the Treadwear Grade was originally intended to be assigned purely scientifically, it has also become a marketing tool used by manufacturers to help position and promote their tires.
End quote.
https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=48
Quote from the TR website:
Unfortunately, the rating that is of the most interest to consumers is the one that appears to be the least consistent. While the Treadwear Grade was originally intended to be assigned purely scientifically, it has also become a marketing tool used by manufacturers to help position and promote their tires.
End quote.
https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=48
Last edited:
spankye
Go Kart Newbie
- Location
- Greensboro, NC
- Car(s)
- 2016 GTI Autobahn
What UHP A/S tire has a 500 UTQG rating?
How many enthusiasts are buying 500 UTQG rated tires?
https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=General&tireModel=G-MAX+AS-05
Same here. I just bought these. However, I’m not going into these tires thinking they’ll be PS4S killers but if they perform at a high level for 2 years (24-30K) and have better wet performance than Indy 500’s I’ll be happy.
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The point is that TR is essentially telling people the UTQG ratings aren't reliable so you shouldn't be using them to determine which tire will actually wear longer. Doing so means you got duped by marketing hype.
I think most people understand the Indy 500 is an OK price point tire. It's certainly not the best tire in it's performance category. The Michelin cost ~40% more for the 225/40R18 than the Indy 500 so you would hope it delivers more.
I think most people understand the Indy 500 is an OK price point tire. It's certainly not the best tire in it's performance category. The Michelin cost ~40% more for the 225/40R18 than the Indy 500 so you would hope it delivers more.