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3rd Gen EA888 (VVL & MPI) - Confirm?

M

mittenz

Ready to race!
Location
Canada
Howdy,

I've been reading some arguments over the actual specs of the Gen3 Ea888 2.0L Audi/VW engines and I'm starting to confuse myself as to what exactly the North American bound GTI's have in them...

From what I've read the north american bound EA888's in the GTI are not products of german but actually assembled in Silao Mexico, the US engine does not have VVL or MPI (Direct + Port injection) and the Canadian engine does not have MPI. These featues are being claimed to only be available on the Golf R and Audi line.

As I personally don't intend to tare down my car and my local dealer is less than useless... can anyone confirm what is in fact in the 3rd gen EA888 in the GTI, and possibly the 1.8 for the Golf folk out their?

http://www.cargroup.org/assets/speakers/presentations/40/schmidt_oliver.pdf

Document from the GM states the US doesn't get MPI but what about Canada :(
 
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M

mittenz

Ready to race!
Location
Canada
Emailed VW Can and VWoA for a response, also contacted a few local dealers asking that they snap a picture for me with the plastic covers off.

According to an unconfirmed source VWoA opted not to include VVL or MPI for the first model year due to availability.... this is disappointing if found to be true.
 
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F

flug20121

New member
Location
Florida
Haven't read the whole thing yet but maybe this is of interest. I'm in the position myself to pull the trigger on an MK7 and still reading up on it...

http://autofarm.blogspot.com/2013/02/inside-new-green-silao-vw-starts-ea888.html

mstoochn said:
Emailed VW Can and VWoA for a response, also contacted a few local dealers asking that they snap a picture for me with the plastic covers off.

According to an unconfirmed source VWoA opted not to include VVL or MPI for the first model year due to availability.... this is disappointing if found to be true.
Click to expand...
 
M

mittenz

Ready to race!
Location
Canada
flug2012 said:
Haven't read the whole thing yet but maybe this is of interest. I'm in the position myself to pull the trigger on an MK7 and still reading up on it...

http://autofarm.blogspot.com/2013/02/inside-new-green-silao-vw-starts-ea888.html
Click to expand...

No relevant info there :( below I have attached to images - I am curious if that extra plastic panel is an indicator of whether or not the EA888 is equipment with MPI, the top is taken from a 2015 MK7 GTI from a US show room, the bottom picture is from EU.


 
plat

plat

Ready to race!
Location
BC Canada
I did some research on the internet and found this VW North America Press Release here: http://www.audiboost.com/content.php?3524-VW-2-0-TSI-gets-10-horsepower-bump-for-rest-of-the-2013-model-year-and-onward-210-horsepower-Gen-3-EA888-2-0-turbo-engine-replaces-Gen-2-Press-Release

Essentially, what the illustration shows is that North American EA888 engines from Silao, Mexico will not have MPI. As for VVL, my GTI's 2nd Gen EA888 has VVL. It would not make sense for VVL to be absent from the 3rd Gen EA888.

MPI, as described in a Europe press-release, helps prevent carbon build-up in the EA888 engine by injecting fuel before the valves at low revs and FSI takes over at high revs for increased efficiency and performance. I have a feeling MPI did not make it in the North American EA888's due to emissions regulations or something to do with that. Or else, it will not make sense for VW to come up with a different version of EA888 (3rd gen) just for our market (i.e., it does not make good business sense). Or, VW did this in purpose to differentiate their engines from AUDI's EA888. But, again, knowing the purpose of the MPI and its benefits, this will be a stupid reason to eliminate MPI in VW EA888 engines.

MFI has a bank of fuel injectors attached to the intake manifold. So, it will be easy to confirm if North American EA888's (whether VW or AUDI) have it.
 
M

mittenz

Ready to race!
Location
Canada
plat said:
I did some research on the internet and found this VW North America Press Release here: http://www.audiboost.com/content.php?3524-VW-2-0-TSI-gets-10-horsepower-bump-for-rest-of-the-2013-model-year-and-onward-210-horsepower-Gen-3-EA888-2-0-turbo-engine-replaces-Gen-2-Press-Release

Essentially, what the illustration shows is that North American EA888 engines from Silao, Mexico will not have MPI. As for VVL, my GTI's 2nd Gen EA888 has VVL. It would not make sense for VVL to be absent from the 3rd Gen EA888.

MPI, as described in a Europe press-release, helps prevent carbon build-up in the EA888 engine by injecting fuel before the valves at low revs and FSI takes over at high revs for increased efficiency and performance. I have a feeling MPI did not make it in the North American EA888's due to emissions regulations or something to do with that. Or else, it will not make sense for VW to come up with a different version of EA888 (3rd gen) just for our market (i.e., it does not make good business sense). Or, VW did this in purpose to differentiate their engines from AUDI's EA888. But, again, knowing the purpose of the MPI and its benefits, this will be a stupid reason to eliminate MPI in VW EA888 engines.

MFI has a bank of fuel injectors attached to the intake manifold. So, it will be easy to confirm if North American EA888's (whether VW or AUDI) have it.
Click to expand...

If that stupid piece of plastic wasn't in the way..

Note page 23 of this doc compared to page 25: http://www.cargroup.org/assets/speakers/presentations/40/schmidt_oliver.pdf

This diagram indicates the US Silao engines have neither VVL or MPI.
 
M

mittenz

Ready to race!
Location
Canada
plat said:
That photo of the Euro EA888 with the manifold cover is a probably a tell-tale sign of the MPI injectors like you suspected.
Click to expand...

So we need to find someone who has a Canadian GTI since the dealers are generally scum bags two have already said no :( how hard it is to pop a piece of plastic off... I even made my email convincing as if I were going to buy one.
 
plat

plat

Ready to race!
Location
BC Canada
mstoochn said:
So we need to find someone who has a Canadian GTI since the dealers are generally scum bags two have already said no :( how hard it is to pop a piece of plastic off... I even made my email convincing as if I were going to buy one.
Click to expand...

I found someone with an MK7 GTI in Italy who posted pics without the manifold cover. The photos show the MPI harness and fuel rail on the intake manifold.

Here is the link: http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?6895387-Naias-2014-mk7-gti&p=84695231

Look at thread #74 and 77. The photo of the North American EA888 is on thread #78. Notice that the MPI harness is absent.
 
M

mittenz

Ready to race!
Location
Canada
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T

TheSwede

Ready to race!
Location
Sweden, Halmstad
Car(s)
Golf7 Alltrack/Cupra
mstoochn said:
No relevant info there :( below I have attached to images - I am curious if that extra plastic panel is an indicator of whether or not the EA888 is equipment with MPI, the top is taken from a 2015 MK7 GTI from a US show room, the bottom picture is from EU.


Click to expand...


Did a check this morning on my EU “R”.

If someone just open the bonnet of a US/CA car and remove the “VW TSI” plastic cover (according to pic. 1 above) you will for sure see the MPI injection - if it exists. On my car there are MPI injectors.

To remove cover. Just pull it vertical “up” and it will loosen. Rubber fasteners helps it to be easy done. Begin with one corner. Very easy to fit again, couldn’t go wrong……:)

/Peter
 
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O

Ottawa GTI1

Passed Driver's Ed
Location
Great White North
Engine Details North America vs. Europe EA0888 Gen3

VW ended up thoroughly confusing everyone with their mixed information that contained Euro-spec. data, US-spec. data etc., which they distributed over the last year or so.

In a nutshell things are like this for the VW 1.8L and 2.0L EA0888 Gen3 engines for North America:

Both the 1.8 and the 2.0:
do not have MPI, but only have DI (direct injection)
do not have the electronic rotary valve temperature control, but rather a simple thermostat

Only the 1.8: does not have VVT on the exhaust cam, does not have the Audi variable valve lift system on the exhaust cam
hence, has lower torque ratings than the Euro-spec. 1.8L engine

Only the 2.0: does have dual cam VVT and exhaust cam variable valve lift
hence, same torque ratings as the Euro-spec. 2.0 engine

MPI is part of the Euro spec. engines as they need to meet the new Euro 6 emission limits which just came into effect; MPI helps with partial-load emission reduction (and is only used under partial load)

VW got around needing MPI in North America as rules here allow to offset higher emissions with "other air improvement measures". In this case, VW coats the radiator with a catalyst material that converts near-ground ozone to oxygen (has been done for some 15 years already by Volvo and others). VW calls it PremAir.
Doing this they have achieved a California ARB classification of Level II SULEV (Ref.: Exec Order A-413-0001).

Implications for everyone are: The radiator has an ID sensor that ties it to the vehicle and is constantly monitored by the ECU.
The rad also has temperature sensor that is bonded to it and cannot be removed without destroying it. It breaks upon removal. This sensor is also tied to the ECU.
These two measures because ARB specifies that the "other measures" have to be designed such that they can't be tampered with.
Practically it means: Can't simply change a rad anymore by yourself.

Those are the key differences.


Does the lack of MPI mean that intake tracts and valves will coke up? Time will tell.
VW did design a complex oil-removal system for the crankcase ventilation system. We'll see if it works as well as it is engineered.
 
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