SuperPro Control Arms vs. Tire Size

Mini7 · Oct 17, 2018

Current Setup:
245-40-18 on 18x8.5 et 45 Neuspeed RSE10’s
Stock Suspension/Stock Ride Height
Regular street driving doesn’t create any rub issues
Slight rub on heavy compression and taking curb at the track(rub in the 10 ‘o clock position)

Proposed track mods:
SuperPro – ALOY 0018K front control arms
034 fixed camber plates

The above should give me much needed front camber to get the following.
-1.5 degrees camber (hoping that it will be closer to -2 degrees)
Zero toe

I will need new tires shortly. Definitely going with MPS4-S again

I am going to stick with stock ride height. I would go with 10-15% stiffer swift springs, but that drops my ride height which I do not want to do.

Question is what size do I put on my RSE10’s?

Will a tucked 245-40-18 work with the SuperPro 0018 control arm or will I have a major rub (no fender mods currently)?

Based on my current setup and what I’ve read online a tucked 235-40-18 Michelin should work with little no rub issues with my proposed mods of SuperPro – ALOY 0018K front control arms and 034 fixed camber plates.

Would I be better off going to RSE5’s with 245-40-17’s?

jmason · Oct 17, 2018

That's a fairly modest camber goal. Have you considered CSS swivels? A more expensive and labor intensive operation, but it is an OEM setup. None of the hassles associated with camber plates.

Mini7 · Oct 17, 2018

I agree that -1.5 degrees is very modest. -2.5 to -3 is more suited to trackwork.

I wanted to keep things simple. Costs relative for a daily driver and a backup track car. My competitive nature wants to go faster and I want less pucker factor when pressing on at the track.

I haven’t looked into CSS swivels and have not idea what is involved or what camber gains are to be had.

My question was centered more on my next tire size considering the SuperPro control arms.

Is this something better handled by a pro-shop or easy enough to do at home on axle stands?

Also, is a tyrolsport deadest kit advisable seeing that I will need to lower the subframe?

donefor · Oct 18, 2018

If you're referring to the 034 "dynamic camber" mounts, they are claimed to give you an additional -1.4 degrees camber, so i think you'll end up with about -2.5. Hope they work for you, i've got some going on next week and i'm stoked to finally be getting a little more camber.

Mini7 · Oct 18, 2018

I would be really happy to get -2.5 degrees up front with the combination of 034 Camber plates, the SuperPro LCA and stock Camber.

I was only expecting about -2 with this setup, but would welcome another half degree.

I still would like some feedback on whether a Deadset Kit is necessary. I definitely want to equalize my Camber left to right and have read that this is not possible with the conical brass bushings in the Deadset Kit. Not sure if this is operator error and lack of experience when doing the alignment.

Slow*Jim · Oct 18, 2018

I have the 034 Dynamic camber mounts and have a pretty significant L/R camber discrepancy, possibly due to the awful roads here and huge potholes I hit daily. Local stealership is useless when it comes to properly shifting the subframe for alignments. I will probably try the CTS deadset kit.

BTW, Whiteline also makes control arms and they are about half the price of Superpro. They add 2.5 caster which would be a lot for a lowered car but if you are staying with OE springs it should be perfect. They also add .3 negative camber

Mini7 · Oct 18, 2018

SlowJim, I would think a Deadset Kit will help your situation along with some high profile tires.

I didn’t realize that our front subframe made for a tricky alignment.

The whiteline LCA looks very much like the SuperPro unit. I would prefer more Caster but believe that I would run into tire clearance issues, unless I went down to a 17” wheel/tire combo.
I would rather stay at stock ride height and gain the additional grip from wider tires for the track.

jmason · Oct 18, 2018

Mini7 said:
Is this something better handled by a pro-shop or easy enough to do at home on axle stands?

Also, is a tyrolsport deadest kit advisable seeing that I will need to lower the subframe?

I did the installation by myself at home. It took several hours, but wasn't particularly difficult.

I have the Tyrolsport deadset. This sort of thing does complicate side-to-side camber adjustment, although mine is nearly equal. I'm not sure I can tell any difference in performance, but too many other things changed at once to really get a good feel.

Slow*Jim · Oct 18, 2018

According to the installation instructions for the Whiteline arms:

These control arms have been tested and
proven with OE 19 inch wheels with minor
ride height reduction.
Vehicles lowered extensively and/or have
been fitted with after-market wheels - check
for any clearance concerns with inner guard.

Mini7 · Nov 7, 2018

So I have the car scheduled to go into DAP Repair in Cornelius to get the control arms and camber plates installed on Friday.

Very interested to feel the improvements in front end grip at VIR.

So I stopped by Discount tire to get my wheels rebalanced and was shown a small 1/2” cut down to the cords. Going back to VIR in 2-weeks and was planning to run with the same setup. I wanted to see if the 245-40-18’s were going to rub with the SuperPro control arms.

This new development is really frustrating.

I’m going to take the cautious route and drop down to a 235-40-18 Michelin Pilot Sport 4S. I wonder if I will notice the grip change with a marginally skinnier tire but with much better alignment geometry.

Swoope · Nov 7, 2018

going to run RR this weekend.

going to be running/heat cycling two sets of tires.

kook s3 in 235 40 18 8.6 tread width and 26.4 dia.

kumho 720 245 45 17 8.9 tread width and 25.7 dia.

going to be interesting.

last tires on car, falken 615
245 45 17 that were really good track tires till one seperated a belt about two track days before they would have been done.

beers

Mini7 · Nov 8, 2018

swoope said:
going to run RR this weekend.

going to be running/heat cycling two sets of tires.

kook s3 in 235 40 18 8.6 tread width and 26.4 dia.

kumho 720 245 45 17 8.9 tread width and 25.7 dia.

going to be interesting.

last tires on car, falken 615
245 45 17 that were really good track tires till one seperated a belt about two track days before they would have been done.

beers

Are you running SuperPro front control arms?

I would think that running a 245 width tire on a 17”rim will clear with little to no issues when combined with the SuperPro front control arms.

Wondering whether I need to sell my Neuspeed RSE10’s and go to RES 5’s and a 17” setup.

Swoope · Nov 8, 2018

Mini7 said:
Are you running SuperPro front control arms?

I would think that running a 245 width tire on a 17”rim will clear with little to no issues when combined with the SuperPro front control arms.

Wondering whether I need to sell my Neuspeed RSE10’s and go to RES 5’s and a 17” setup.

car is stock other than front pads and intercooler.

i am a little concerned that the 235 45 18 might be to tall. we will see.

with my luck lately kumhos will chunk after heat cycle and kooks will rub, and i will become captain ride along. lol

i do have an offer from a friend/instructor to drive his exocet, i have ridden in it before and it is stupid fast!

hope to get a little footage of my friend in the mini gp, but it wont be much. that car is stupid fast also.

you can save lots of money in track tires with 17" wheels.

rx8 needs new motor, house ac just went. so right now gti stays stock. the 7k for house ac would have covered new motor and coilovers for gti. DAMN AC! lol

beers

Mini7 · Nov 24, 2018

OK, so I got my SuperPro control arms fitted, along with a set of 034 Motorsports fixed camber plates.

Front
-2 degrees camber
-8 Castor
Zero Toe

Rear
-1.8 degrees camber
.2 degrees toe in each side (.4 degrees total toe in)

No rubbing issues with 235-40-18 MPS4S on My Neuspeed RSE 10’s 18x8.5

I am running stock struts at stock ride height. I was shooting for -2.5 degrees up front.

My best all weekend was a 2:19.86

I ran a 2:19.03 without the added camber but on 245-40-18 MPS4S ( slight rub ) so not an apples to apples comparison. I gave up some tire grip by dropping to 235 section width. Wear is better but the front still needs more camber. At least another -.5 to -.75 degrees up front.

245 section tire on 17” dedicated track wheel like RE71’s or NT 01’s. The Michelin’s will be the wet weather option.

A larger rear sway bar is also on the list of next mods.

Navi · Nov 24, 2018

I'm confused.. I thought the superpro arms add around -1.5 to -2 camber and the 034 camber mounts add -1.4 camber. How did DAP get you to -2 degrees total. Did they dial out some camber?

SuperPro Control Arms vs. Tire Size

Mini7

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jmason

Go Kart Newbie

Mini7

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donefor

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Mini7

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Slow*Jim

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Mini7

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jmason

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Slow*Jim

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Mini7

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Swoope

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Mini7

Autocross Champion

Swoope

Ready to race!

Mini7

Autocross Champion

Navi

Autocross Champion