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Old 11-18-2018, 03:33 PM   #1
NJ_MK7
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Sachs 4 puck- thoughts?

Anyone running this clutch with a dmf? Looking for experiences and feedback, specifically as a daily driver.

Thanks in advance.
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Old 12-04-2018, 03:48 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ_MK7 View Post
Anyone running this clutch with a dmf? Looking for experiences and feedback, specifically as a daily driver.

Thanks in advance.

I just installed this setup I'll let you know once it breaks in a bit.
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Old 12-04-2018, 04:14 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ITGUY View Post
I just installed this setup I'll let you know once it breaks in a bit.
Thanks, much appreciated
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Old 12-04-2018, 04:58 AM   #4
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What are your power goals? Why not Sachs performance clutch?
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Old 12-04-2018, 02:31 PM   #5
NJ_MK7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by navindralr View Post
What are your power goals? Why not Sachs performance clutch?
Likely hybrid - is38x, l450 or eqt.

in speaking with the shop i plan to use to install, he strongly recommended the 4 puck over as he has seen the performance clutch not be able to hold the hybrid power levels.
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Old 12-04-2018, 03:04 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ_MK7 View Post
Likely hybrid - is38x, l450 or eqt.

in speaking with the shop i plan to use to install, he strongly recommended the 4 puck over as he has seen the performance clutch not be able to hold the hybrid power levels.
Are you on the MQB Facebook Group? I see this clutch mentioned a few times and one of the people that does install in Jersey usually recommends this setup. Seems like people like it.

Also I believe you can get this from FCP Euro which means...lifetime warranty? I guess. Lol.
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Old 12-04-2018, 03:16 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MiamiBourne View Post
Are you on the MQB Facebook Group? I see this clutch mentioned a few times and one of the people that does install in Jersey usually recommends this setup. Seems like people like it.

Also I believe you can get this from FCP Euro which means...lifetime warranty? I guess. Lol.
I am not... but yes, my installer is in NNJ and highly recommends this clutch.

and haha, just took delivery from FCP.
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Old 12-04-2018, 04:35 PM   #8
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Billy's last install was my car..

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Old 12-04-2018, 07:57 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ_MK7 View Post
I am not... but yes, my installer is in NNJ and highly recommends this clutch.

and haha, just took delivery from FCP.
Do you daily this car? Did they say it would be okay to use this clutch for a car that's a daily driver?
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Old 12-04-2018, 08:25 PM   #10
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mine is a daily
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Old 12-04-2018, 10:00 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by MiamiBourne View Post
Do you daily this car? Did they say it would be okay to use this clutch for a car that's a daily driver?
Yes, car is daily and was told that it would be fine to use as a daily.
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Old 12-19-2018, 12:53 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by NJ_MK7 View Post
I am not... but yes, my installer is in NNJ and highly recommends this clutch.

and haha, just took delivery from FCP.
Q1. do you have a link to the clutch you bought? looking at this option as well. excelerate performance has been quoted as saying the 4puck clutch from sachs was literally ON/OFF nature and not livable for a daily driver.

Q2: the clutch you bought you will go with the SMF or DMF? b/c according to Sachs website it mates with the "original flywheel" which is DMF.

Q3: is this the clutch you bought? here: https://www.sachsperformance.com/en/...-002352-999505

thanks much!!
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Old 12-19-2018, 01:49 AM   #13
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1. According to the shop that recommended and is doing the install, that is not the case. I've also spoke with 2 people who have had this installed by this same shop and do not report on/off or race like clutch.

2. I am using my DMF

3. I ordered the following from FCP Euro:
Clutch Disc Sachs Performance - 881864999505
Audi VW Pressure Plate Sachs Performance - 883082001422

(The Golf R uses a slightly different PP part number)

Hope this helps.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Golf7RR View Post
Q1. do you have a link to the clutch you bought? looking at this option as well. excelerate performance has been quoted as saying the 4puck clutch from sachs was literally ON/OFF nature and not livable for a daily driver.


Q2: the clutch you bought you will go with the SMF or DMF? b/c according to Sachs website it mates with the "original flywheel" which is DMF.



Q3: is this the clutch you bought? here: https://www.sachsperformance.com/en/...-002352-999505



thanks much!!
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Old 12-19-2018, 01:56 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Golf7RR View Post
Q1. do you have a link to the clutch you bought? looking at this option as well. excelerate performance has been quoted as saying the 4puck clutch from sachs was literally ON/OFF nature and not livable for a daily driver.

Q2: the clutch you bought you will go with the SMF or DMF? b/c according to Sachs website it mates with the "original flywheel" which is DMF.

Q3: is this the clutch you bought? here: https://www.sachsperformance.com/en/...-002352-999505

thanks much!!
1. If you read the post by Excelerate where they said that, you will see they later retract it. They were basing that off of older TDi clutches and not this version or an actual experience with it.

2. You can go with either. They offer a SMF option on their (Sachs') website.

3. Your link is the one I got.
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Old 12-19-2018, 11:54 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ_MK7 View Post
1. According to the shop that recommended and is doing the install, that is not the case. I've also spoke with 2 people who have had this installed by this same shop and do not report on/off or race like clutch.

2. I am using my DMF

3. I ordered the following from FCP Euro:
Clutch Disc Sachs Performance - 881864999505
Audi VW Pressure Plate Sachs Performance - 883082001422

(The Golf R uses a slightly different PP part number)

Hope this helps.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeDude View Post
1. If you read the post by Excelerate where they said that, you will see they later retract it. They were basing that off of older TDi clutches and not this version or an actual experience with it.

2. You can go with either. They offer a SMF option on their (Sachs') website.

3. Your link is the one I got.
Thanks guys for trying to help. Somedude, did you stay with DMF?

I'm getting confused between these clutches.
So the one i Linked has torque at 810+Nm but that's with DMF. once you go to the SMF it's rated at 600+Nm. Here's where i'm getting my info:https://www.sachsperformance.com/en/...-4motion-221kw

so now i'm confused why is DMF rated higher than SMF. Also what are the advantages/disadvantages of going SMF or DMF then? the only ones I think of are. DMF will be less chatter. DMF might not be up to snuff with power like big turbo,hybrid EQT. But confused why the rating with DMF is higher on their website. another is DMF is heavier with more parts/springs etc so RPM matching downshifting is slower. I would gladly stay with DMF if i know it can withstand stage 3 like power levels, at least i wouldn't have as much chatter. my other options was SB daily (which is at the upper limit of being able toh old stg III power reliably) or endurance(which can hold the power but prone to heating (kevlar lining) if dragging, not that I do that but perhaps occasionally).

Lastly, I really do not understand how a 4puck design (less contact area vs a full faced) can have more holding power??? also do you think it have any longevity to it or will last less than a full faced organic/sintered friction disk? (assuming same driver with 30+ years of experience driving manuals)
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Old 12-19-2018, 12:30 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Golf7RR View Post
Thanks guys for trying to help. Somedude, did you stay with DMF?

I'm getting confused between these clutches.
So the one i Linked has torque at 810+Nm but that's with DMF. once you go to the SMF it's rated at 600+Nm. Here's where i'm getting my info:https://www.sachsperformance.com/en/...-4motion-221kw

so now i'm confused why is DMF rated higher than SMF. Also what are the advantages/disadvantages of going SMF or DMF then? the only ones I think of are. DMF will be less chatter. DMF might not be up to snuff with power like big turbo,hybrid EQT. But confused why the rating with DMF is higher on their website. another is DMF is heavier with more parts/springs etc so RPM matching downshifting is slower. I would gladly stay with DMF if i know it can withstand stage 3 like power levels, at least i wouldn't have as much chatter. my other options was SB daily (which is at the upper limit of being able toh old stg III power reliably) or endurance(which can hold the power but prone to heating (kevlar lining) if dragging, not that I do that but perhaps occasionally).

Lastly, I really do not understand how a 4puck design (less contact area vs a full faced) can have more holding power??? also do you think it have any longevity to it or will last less than a full faced organic/sintered friction disk? (assuming same driver with 30+ years of experience driving manuals)
I am staying with DMF. Honestly, I think it may be a typo on their website unless they use a pressure plate with less clamping force on the SMF kit.

As for advantages of one or the other: DMF will be quieter at idle and having more mass will make it smoother from a stop and/or require less revs to get moving. SMF has less mass, so it will free rev and drop revs faster. This requires a little more skill to start smoothly and will allow for easier rev matching when changing gears. For ultimate performance, SMF is the better option. Until I plan to shoot for more than 600 ft lbs of torque, I am content with a DMF.

The reason a 4 puck is rated for more are the material differences in the friction surfaces. The coefficient of friction for ceramic is nearly double the coefficient of friction for organic (0.4-0.6 for ceramic vs. 0.25-0.3 for organic). You multiply the clamping force of the pressure plate by the friction coefficient to get the friction force between the disk and flywheel. As long as the friction force is higher than the reactionary force created by the engine torque, it will hold fine.

Additionally, friction force is not a function of area, so theoretically less contact area doesn't make a difference in transmittable torque through a clutch. However, shear stress (which is affected by cross sectional area) is a factor they must consider when design the clutch disk, so they can't make it infinitesimally small.

As far as clutch life, only time will tell. Depends on how you use the car. If it is for spirited daily driving, I suspect it will last a long time. If you are drag racing every weekend, not so much.

Hope that helps.
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Old 12-19-2018, 03:03 PM   #17
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I'm likely going this route also, but I probably won't exceed 350lb of torque. Hopefully this setup is great for daily/traffic and has good modulation. I could just turn down the boost and let my stock clutch live, but I'm telling myself this clutch upgrade is a reliability and longevity upgrade.
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