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Boss 500 Project

crystalwhiteveedub

Gas Sipper
Location
South Georgia
Car(s)
2009 5 Door GTI
You understand that there’s allot left on the table and the boss 600 kit is only limited by the tuner who choose to run this type of power level because the stock block/head, and fuel/fueling. Obviously you’re tuner feels different but the 600 is more capable of more power if brave or on a built motor. I’m assuming that yours is some sort of hybrid? Personally a big point for me was the ballbearings of the garret, and you can use any dp and you may have to make a reducer for whatever your intake is, you may not.

It’s nice you like your kit and meth, it’s great to have more options trickling down. But to try and compare 2 different setups on two different dynos on two different days by two different tuners, who may have different goals in the end tuning, is laughable, longevity may be a bigger concern for some also, and they might run more conservative than really needed. Some others will like the boss or aprs or iroz’s. Truth is you get allot of capability on a dead nuts solid, historically reliable turbo that can take an absolute beating with the boss kit at a fairly cheap price, your hybrid is an unknown reliability wise simply because it hasn’t been around long and doesn’t really address one of the biggest faults of the oem design. For basically 200 less than you spent, assuming it was 3950 as their website says, you can buy the boss kit and the intake. If your kit makes you happy at that price great, some of us will choose the boss kit at that price point, and we have our reasons.

1. Turbo is based on Garrett Gtx3071r and is true ball bearing.
2. Price may be higher by $950 but it is a true drop in solution with no hassle simlar to is38 install.
3. We are torque limited (to save the rods) with wastegate duty at 30% so it has MUCH more left in the turbo.
4. Longevity and durability of the turbo is impressive. Blown DV caused the turbo to run at 100% wgdc (40-45psi) and melted the DV housing but never skipped a beat.

Even for the $950 price increase I think its worth it. You get better customer service, easier drop-in install, and great spool time with the top end power of the 3071.
 

KASPER1

Go Kart Champion
Location
AMONGST U
1. Turbo is based on Garrett Gtx3071r and is true ball bearing.
2. Price may be higher by $950 but it is a true drop in solution with no hassle simlar to is38 install.
3. We are torque limited (to save the rods) with wastegate duty at 30% so it has MUCH more left in the turbo.
4. Longevity and durability of the turbo is impressive. Blown DV caused the turbo to run at 100% wgdc (40-45psi) and melted the DV housing but never skipped a beat.

Even for the $950 price increase I think its worth it. You get better customer service, easier drop-in install, and great spool time with the top end power of the 3071.

Sounds very nice, allot better than the other type of hybrid turbo kits I’ve been reading about. I don’t know much about your particular kit but will admit, by the info you’ve shared, it sounds allot better than I had initially thought. I am curious as to what “based” on a garret gtx3071r exactly means. I would assume that they would have similar ceilings if pushed to the maximum then, sounds like a pretty decent setup, glad you’re happy, I’m happy with the 600, guess the money saved paid for the intake and dv then, personally I thought the 600 turbo kit install was easy, the fueling kit sucked to do though lol

Anyway, if it’s that similar it should make roughly the same peak hp assuming the same tuner, additional mods. In that case, they’re both begging for built blocks and heads and 40 + psi. I know the Garret’s really seem to love it over 30, that’s when they really start to come alive.
 

flipflp

Autocross Newbie
Location
PNW
Car(s)
'16 Golf R DSG
1. Turbo is based on Garrett Gtx3071r and is true ball bearing.
2. Price may be higher by $950 but it is a true drop in solution with no hassle simlar to is38 install.
3. We are torque limited (to save the rods) with wastegate duty at 30% so it has MUCH more left in the turbo.
4. Longevity and durability of the turbo is impressive. Blown DV caused the turbo to run at 100% wgdc (40-45psi) and melted the DV housing but never skipped a beat.

Even for the $950 price increase I think its worth it. You get better customer service, easier drop-in install, and great spool time with the top end power of the 3071.

Only thing I can say, because if the Mabo is a ball bearing Garrett core like the BOSS turbo the cost makes sense (EDIT: Mabo turbo is not a garrett core, and aside from inducer/exducer sizing they don't share the same tech). The turbo inlet pipe/intake setup on the Mabo vs the BOSS is a wash for me, very slight setup differences, not even worth discussing. Just different ways of going about the same thing. Overall I'd say they install the same.

The thing that makes your comparison difficult is why would 2 similar turbos spool so differently. Unless the CTS exhaust housing has a massive AR or is just poorly designed, my guess would be your tuner and not the turbo that is making the biggest difference there. I wish more dyno runs had PSI lines as well, it'd make this a more productive conversation.

You can request a turbo to make boost very early, but you run the risk of surge, as well as a hard torque hit right at onset. It's not just the torque number that is going to save rods, but how hard the torque hits. If you look at a lot of IS20/IS38 dynos you'll see a peak very low, but because the torque isn't high numbers wise that can be safe. 26 PSI at 3500rpm like you said, on a turbo that big, would be moving more air than the engine can even use and you're gonna have surge. Surge can cause turbo failures if unchecked. Looking at the Mabotech website, I don't see any anti surge tech on the compressor housing.
 
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crystalwhiteveedub

Gas Sipper
Location
South Georgia
Car(s)
2009 5 Door GTI
I do not know the specs of the Mabotech M560is, I have asked Frank and he doesnt seem to want the information out there. I do know it is “based” as in similar in size to the gtx3071r, but with a noticeably quicker spool. This is the reason I chose it. According to logs with no change in fueling setup (same methanol, lpfp, hpfp, DI only) I only lost 200 rpm of spool time from the is38 to make similar pressure numbers. And the top end pulls forever.

The dyno I used was a dynocom with ZERO load applied so the turbo did not spool until 4200rpm, and make 28psi peak. (Spools at 3500 and makes 31 peak on the road.) According to a Virtual Dyno plot taken from a datalog and calculated load, weight, etc. the car should make 516/434 in its current trim. Now, obviously that can be taken for what its worth. I know I have a LOT left in the turbo when im ready to add clutchpacks and internals, which is another reason I went with Frank as a tuner and hardware supplier...he will retune it for me at my leisure from my laptop, for free.

Both turbos are more than enough to make big power for sure, and of course I’m biased, but I believe the $950 extra is more than worth it over the Boss kits.
 

Daument

Ready to race!
Location
SE PA
You understand that there’s allot left on the table and the boss 600 kit is only limited by the tuner who choose to run this type of power level because the stock block/head, and fuel/fueling. Obviously you’re tuner feels different but the 600 is more capable of more power if brave or on a built motor. I’m assuming that yours is some sort of hybrid? Personally a big point for me was the ballbearings of the garret, and you can use any dp and you may have to make a reducer for whatever your intake is, you may not.



It’s nice you like your kit and meth, it’s great to have more options trickling down. But to try and compare 2 different setups on two different dynos on two different days by two different tuners, who may have different goals in the end tuning, is laughable, longevity may be a bigger concern for some also, and they might run more conservative than really needed. Some others will like the boss or aprs or iroz’s. Truth is you get allot of capability on a dead nuts solid, historically reliable turbo that can take an absolute beating with the boss kit at a fairly cheap price, your hybrid is an unknown reliability wise simply because it hasn’t been around long and doesn’t really address one of the biggest faults of the oem design. For basically 200 less than you spent, assuming it was 3950 as their website says, you can buy the boss kit and the intake. If your kit makes you happy at that price great, some of us will choose the boss kit at that price point, and we have our reasons.



^^ my thoughts exactly.... is38’s are known to expire early when pushed hard. The Garrett is pretty bulletproof at 30psi and above. If I decide to change the pump and throw a set of rods and pistons it will easily make 600whp.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
 

jiannu

Ready to race!
Location
Toronto
^^ my thoughts exactly.... is38’s are known to expire early when pushed hard. The Garrett is pretty bulletproof at 30psi and above. If I decide to change the pump and throw a set of rods and pistons it will easily make 600whp.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
Ya......but how's the lag?

I bought a 600 kit but had my heart set on a is38 hybrid and just not sure on how it compares? Got a great deal but it was v.1 need to upgrade to v2.

Sent from my SM-N950U1 using Tapatalk
 

Daument

Ready to race!
Location
SE PA
Ya......but how's the lag?

I bought a 600 kit but had my heart set on a is38 hybrid and just not sure on how it compares? Got a great deal but it was v.1 need to upgrade to v2.

Sent from my SM-N950U1 using Tapatalk



As it turns out... the car is more civil to drive normally. When it was a stage two uni car it made a more power/torque down low and fell off harshly around 5k....and was harder to drive “normally”. The big turbo come on hard at 4-4500 and pulls way harder to redline. So, to answer your question, it’s more civil at low revs and throws down when you want it to.... still getting 27-30mpg when driving within the speed limits...so to speak. Perhaps you should consider a 500 kit if you want to spool earlier.

Uni stage 2



UM boss 600



Bottom line.... it ran nice with the uni tune, now.... Let’s just say I’m really happy. It’s Way Faster
 

Daument

Ready to race!
Location
SE PA
1. Turbo is based on Garrett Gtx3071r and is true ball bearing.

2. Price may be higher by $950 but it is a true drop in solution with no hassle simlar to is38 install.

3. We are torque limited (to save the rods) with wastegate duty at 30% so it has MUCH more left in the turbo.

4. Longevity and durability of the turbo is impressive. Blown DV caused the turbo to run at 100% wgdc (40-45psi) and melted the DV housing but never skipped a beat.



Even for the $950 price increase I think its worth it. You get better customer service, easier drop-in install, and great spool time with the top end power of the 3071.



Let’s see your dyno info


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
 

crystalwhiteveedub

Gas Sipper
Location
South Georgia
Car(s)
2009 5 Door GTI
Let’s see your dyno info


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Actual Dynocom dyno was a local who didnt know anything about VW and said he didnt know how to pick up an rpm signal...so no torque curve. When I find a dyno that isnt 2+ hours away that knows how to dyno a DSG vehicle (what a nightmare watching that struggle) then I’ll get a better sheet.

Second is a recent Virtual dyno, I’ll have to get one made and prettied up for the most recent logs. This is more or less just to see the torque curve, but is proven to be somewhat accurate representation of power output on the street under load.
 

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rafycotto

Ready to race!
I bought a boss 600 V2 last week. I will share info once it installed. Im going with Maestro tune and including MPI.
Expecting everything done by Jun 9. At least everything installed


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Daument

Ready to race!
Location
SE PA
I bought a boss 600 V2 last week. I will share info once it installed. Im going with Maestro tune and including MPI.
Expecting everything done by Jun 9. At least everything installed


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Who’s fueling kit?


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