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Old 07-01-2016, 06:12 PM   #1
Jlungo
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Sachs Racing Clutch vs Southbend Stage 3 Daily

Hey everyone, hope you are all enjoying summer with your awesome cars.
I was looking for a little bit of input in regards to comparing the performance benefits of a dual mass fly wheel to a single mass. My top choices i am comparing here are listed below.
-BFI Club Sport/Sachs Racing Clutch Kit
http://store.blackforestindustries.com/bficlspsarac1

-SRE Clutch kit stage 1 from Ed
http://www.emmanueledesign.com/colle...e-1-clutch-kit

-Southbend Stage 3 Daily

I am leaning more towards the Sachs kits because i enjoy the stock feel. I dont mind stiffer because that is expected but one thing that just kills me is chatter or really any noise that sounds like a rattle that i can hear at idle bouncing off other cars, it literally drives me insane.

Conversely if anyone has some input on chatter, and engagment not just performance of dual vs single.
I am tuned with apr is38 and my stock is not holding the power sadly, but it played it's part valiantly.

Have a great 4th of July weekend everyone!
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Last edited by Jlungo; 07-01-2016 at 07:08 PM.
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Old 07-01-2016, 06:37 PM   #2
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Old 07-01-2016, 06:57 PM   #3
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Forgot, is this my paesano?
anyway there will be chatter with any single mass flywheel you decide to go with.

I have the south bend stage 3 endurance and yes there is some chatter, but in my case its not significant. I can hear it if everything around me is quiet. If there is any noise at all, birds chirping, cars idling next to you, you cannot hear it. That does not seem to be the case with the South Bend Stage 2 as people seem to report its much louder.

I am in CT, which is not to far from New Jersey, if you are around the area feel free to PM and you see the car in person and can decide for your self.

Personally if you want to replace the clutch once I am thinking you would need to go with the South Bend Stage 3, I am not sure if the other can hold the power. My clutch is rated for 580 lb torque.
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Old 07-01-2016, 07:05 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ital View Post
Forgot, is this my paesano?
anyway there will be chatter with any single mass flywheel you decide to go with.

I have the south bend stage 3 endurance and yes there is some chatter, but in my case its not significant. I can hear it if everything around me is quiet. If there is any noise at all, birds chirping, cars idling next to you, you cannot hear it. That does not seem to be the case with the South Bend Stage 2 as people seem to report its much louder.

I am in CT, which is not to far from New Jersey, if you are around the area feel free to PM and you see the car in person and can decide for your self.

Personally if you want to replace the clutch once I am thinking you would need to go with the South Bend Stage 3, I am not sure if the other can hold the power. My clutch is rated for 580 lb torque.
Si! E io!

I remember your posts about your clutch. Thats great to hear that you like your setup so far.

Im really curious to know how much more beneficial a single mass is compared to a dual mass. I like stock feel but is going single that much better?

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Old 07-01-2016, 07:21 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Jlungo View Post
Si! E io!

I remember your posts about your clutch. Thats great to hear that you like your setup so far.

Im really curious to know how much more beneficial a single mass is compared to a dual mass. I like stock feel but is going single that much better?

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I am the same way, I do not want my car to sound like a diesel, its brand new.. people would be what is wrong with you car?
Maybe I got lucky but my chatter is not noticeble... you are in luck though, I got mine done in Jersey at RSW so you should have the same outcome :-)
Compare to stuck my engagement is much quicker and I can floor it in 6th gear anytime with no issues
also clutch spring resistance is much stiffer I would say +30% compared to stuck, which kind of forces you to do quicker pedal release thus you shift faster :-)
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Old 07-01-2016, 07:42 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ital View Post
I am the same way, I do not want my car to sound like a diesel, its brand new.. people would be what is wrong with you car?
Maybe I got lucky but my chatter is not noticeble... you are in luck though, I got mine done in Jersey at RSW so you should have the same outcome :-)
Compare to stuck my engagement is much quicker and I can floor it in 6th gear anytime with no issues
also clutch spring resistance is much stiffer I would say +30% compared to stuck, which kind of forces you to do quicker pedal release thus you shift faster :-)
That sounds good and all. But something is drawing me to the Sachs. I don't know why. Both are rated higher than what my torque output currently is so i feel id get what im asking either way. But is a single better than a dual when it comes to performance is what i need to find out.

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Old 07-03-2016, 04:58 PM   #7
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Old 07-03-2016, 06:14 PM   #8
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Thanks lol

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Old 07-03-2016, 08:18 PM   #9
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Thanks lol

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Ha no problem. Did you see on BFI's website that they "STRONGLY" recommend buying a new flywheel along with their clutch?
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Old 07-04-2016, 12:20 AM   #10
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My experience:

When APR Stage 1 proved too much for the clutch, I switched to the low output program and it seemed to work. No slip at least in warm weather. Had the SRE clutch installed along with Stage 1 file. I am pleased after two weeks. The clutch does not slip. Effort required has gone up by maybe 50%, but is very acceptable. Easier than my muscle cars in the 60s. The Sachs clutch is very smooth and it seems like shorter travel than the original. Because I retained the original dual mass flywheel, there is no noise.
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Old 07-04-2016, 01:33 AM   #11
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Would this be a suitable alternative?

Last edited by Little Nut; 07-04-2016 at 02:35 AM. Reason: Screwed up simple copy/paste
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Old 07-07-2016, 12:45 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TarzanoftheApes View Post
Ha no problem. Did you see on BFI's website that they "STRONGLY" recommend buying a new flywheel along with their clutch?
Wanted to respond to these but the site has been acting funny. I saw the BFI recommendation and honestly i was going to replace the dmfw with a new one anyway because why not change the whole thing if you are already upgrading the trans.
But the BFI site also said "sacrifice performance for comfort" and i got hesitant
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Old 07-07-2016, 12:48 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghawkins View Post
My experience:

When APR Stage 1 proved too much for the clutch, I switched to the low output program and it seemed to work. No slip at least in warm weather. Had the SRE clutch installed along with Stage 1 file. I am pleased after two weeks. The clutch does not slip. Effort required has gone up by maybe 50%, but is very acceptable. Easier than my muscle cars in the 60s. The Sachs clutch is very smooth and it seems like shorter travel than the original. Because I retained the original dual mass flywheel, there is no noise.
I wouldwould surely hope there would be no slip with the new sre clutch. Which sachs kit did you go with?
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Old 07-07-2016, 01:15 PM   #14
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Would this be a suitable alternative?
Thats an interesting set up he compiled. Its simply a sachs disc. Ttrs pressure plate as the 2 main components. I wonder how much the ttrs plate is rated for? Been trying to google that to no avail
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Old 07-07-2016, 05:20 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Jlungo View Post
I wouldwould surely hope there would be no slip with the new sre clutch. Which sachs kit did you go with?
Sachs Race Engineering Volkswagen Mk7 GTI Stage 1 clutch kit. I did not want the noise associated with a single mass flywheel. I had not allowed much slippage with the old clutch, so my OE flywheel was fine. No slip so far.
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Old 07-07-2016, 05:22 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Jlungo View Post
Thats an interesting set up he compiled. Its simply a sachs disc. Ttrs pressure plate as the 2 main components. I wonder how much the ttrs plate is rated for? Been trying to google that to no avail
Sachs rates this clutch at 405 ft. lbs torque.
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Old 07-07-2016, 06:11 PM   #17
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Sachs rates this clutch at 405 ft. lbs torque.
Isnt the sre stage 1 set to 405+?

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