GOLFMK8
GOLFMK7
GOLFMK6
GOLFMKV

Stratified Automotive Custom Etune

dlau9

Go Kart Champion
Location
Canada
I know it's been mentioned that 5150 never drops below 12 but as far as custom tunes go the other one I've seen (and experienced) is maperformance and they dropped to 11s as well. Is it possible the other tunes being ots tunes just run 12s as a safe standard because it's an ots tune every car that uses it will be different? I only say this because as custome tunes go I've seen them all go 11s except 5150 so taking any biased views out of the equation is it possible 5150 just feels more comfortable with that in his tunes. Not meaning his is better than everyone else because he keeps his afr in the 12s. And as for saying a tuner messes with the knock sensitivity I believe deviation was the only one that said that and I agree with you I don't think anyone has done that.

Sent from my ONEPLUS 5T using Tapatalk

I'm going to be 100% honest and say. That is due to lack of knowledge and experience in understanding the platform. APR spent hundreds of hours on testing in hot, cold and almost every environment and landed on 12+. As well as all other major OTS. Go look what WRXs with a turbo 4 DI motor run tuned. The best subie FA tuner doesn't tune for 11's

I think I'm going to just drop this debate here oncr and for all and just say it 11 is what you are comfortable with by all means. But you aren't getting close to what the optimal performance of the car can do period.
 

BronxBomber

Ready to race!
Location
Orlando,FL
Mic drop.....
 

Cameron1292

Ready to race!
Location
Florida
I'm going to be 100% honest and say. That is due to lack of knowledge and experience in understanding the platform. APR spent hundreds of hours on testing in hot, cold and almost every environment and landed on 12+. As well as all other major OTS. Go look what WRXs with a turbo 4 DI motor run tuned. The best subie FA tuner doesn't tune for 11's

I think I'm going to just drop this debate here oncr and for all and just say it 11 is what you are comfortable with by all means. But you aren't getting close to what the optimal performance of the car can do period.
I really don't see it as a debate at all lol if it was steady low 11s and dropping to 10 I'd be worried but to me mid to high 11s is very close to 12 and if the car is happy with it I'm fine with it. I trust Apr 100% I just want as thinking it's possible that with their tune being ots meant for different cars with different mods that they might have went a more standard route to get the same results from a car with stock intercooler compared to someone with aftermarket and same with intakes. Could be wrong though. And I did just search 5150 tuning and wrx and first thread showed up and hes in the low to mid 11s. Granted it's an e85/91 tune but still. I also have some numbers from bren tuning I have a buddy getting his fa20 wrx tuned there and they get in the 11s as well and they are a very respected tuner. I trust what you and a few others say about 5150 being great tunes. The numbers show it. That's why I made this thread though to compare my process and results with other tunes because I could barely find anything on stratified out there for our cars. I'm not coming to any conclusions until my full tuning process is complete and my final numbers and logs are finished. If I end up with great numbers and my afr is 11.5 instead of 12, I'm fine with that.

Sent from my ONEPLUS 5T using Tapatalk
 

geebob

Ready to race!
Boost, timing and AFR all do the same thing - increase pressure and temperature in the combustion chamber. Be nice if someone with a 5150 tune on a stock turbo would post AFR, timing and Boost at 6K (from a pre-winter log ... unless you live in Florida I guess.) You need to address all three in relation to each other. Talking about AFR independently is kind of useless.
 

jcarl126

Ready to race!
Location
Wilm, NC
Well, as long as the NC Raleigh dyno day gets filled I will have stratified tune dyno sheets for this forum as well as for Alex. And if that day doesn't fill, spot wise, I'll schedule with my local dyno for the sake of research.
 

Deviation01

Go Kart Champion
Location
St. Louis
Boost, timing and AFR all do the same thing - increase pressure and temperature in the combustion chamber. Be nice if someone with a 5150 tune on a stock turbo would post AFR, timing and Boost at 6K (from a pre-winter log ... unless you live in Florida I guess.) You need to address all three in relation to each other. Talking about AFR independently is kind of useless.

is20 93 oct
AFR 12.94
Timing 6.5
Boost 19

is20 e30 mix @ 6.1K
AFR 12.94
Timing 14
Boost 21 PSI

Make whatever conclusion you want but AFR is not 11s. Those are my last logs with my finalized revision.

Again AFR will not give you gobs of power BUT if a tuner says 11s is great bla bla they are covering for other adjustments they are lazy to fix or do not have the knowledge.

PS. Dyno sheets are pointless it is how the car runs on the street and how it delivers torque. I will take a flat curve of torque through the RPM range vs a peak on a dyno curve.
 

Cameron1292

Ready to race!
Location
Florida
is20 93 oct
AFR 12.94
Timing 6.5
Boost 19

is20 e30 mix @ 6.1K
AFR 12.94
Timing 14
Boost 21 PSI

Make whatever conclusion you want but AFR is not 11s. Those are my last logs with my finalized revision.

Again AFR will not give you gobs of power BUT if a tuner says 11s is great bla bla they are covering for other adjustments they are lazy to fix or do not have the knowledge.

PS. Dyno sheets are pointless it is how the car runs on the street and how it delivers torque. I will take a flat curve of torque through the RPM range vs a peak on a dyno curve.
It's not pointless at all. I really see a super biased with 5150 with you. If your dyno sheet was showing higher numbers than mine and your afr was higher you'd be all over that lol nothing you've said here has been helpful you just chime in with how great your tune is compared to my "incomplete" tune. this thread was created to show progress through a tune that not many people have talked about on here. Not to bash the tuner because one parameter of his tune isn't to your liking.

Sent from my ONEPLUS 5T using Tapatalk
 

Deviation01

Go Kart Champion
Location
St. Louis
It's not pointless at all. I really see a super biased with 5150 with you. If your dyno sheet was showing higher numbers than mine and your afr was higher you'd be all over that lol nothing you've said here has been helpful you just chime in with how great your tune is compared to my "incomplete" tune. this thread was created to show progress through a tune that not many people have talked about on here. Not to bash the tuner because one parameter of his tune isn't to your liking.

Sent from my ONEPLUS 5T using Tapatalk

No I am trying to open your eyes. I am not saying your tune is bad or Strat is bad. I am pointing out what you should look at when you do logs. So that you can understand what is happening with your car.

Progress is not being stuck with tuning methodology from the 90s. (over exaggerating here) It is your car you do what makes you happy. Just learn so that you know what is happening when you look at your own logs.
 

Cameron1292

Ready to race!
Location
Florida
No I am trying to open your eyes. I am not saying your tune is bad or Strat is bad. I am pointing out what you should look at when you do logs. So that you can understand what is happening with your car.

Progress is not being stuck with tuning methodology from the 90s. (over exaggerating here) It is your car you do what makes you happy. Just learn so that you know what is happening when you look at your own logs.
It's my first time being tuned with Cobb but I've had tuned cars for years. I know what to look for. I understand the concept of a threshold for a specific number. This is my first di car and I get the idea of keeping it at 12 or higher. To me though getting within .50 of that is pretty close. That's like saying at redline I should be tapered to 20 psi but I'm really at 19. That makes my tune inferior? I don't think so. Let me finish my tuning process and run some quarters times and get a legit dyno and we can see how this is doing. Until then I think criticizing a small value is pointless. It's about how they all work together. Who knows I could get record times on this tune (totally unlikely lol)

Sent from my ONEPLUS 5T using Tapatalk
 

Hoon

Autocross Champion
Location
Rhode Island
I don't have any experience tuning DI, but a decent amount with port injection, and minor AFR changes don't usually do much.

Personally I'd rather have it a bit fat, lose 5-10hp but keep the chamber and turbine temps lower.
 

Deviation01

Go Kart Champion
Location
St. Louis
The smaller value can lead to big problems. Afr is important if a tuner is using fuel to cover for kr there are other underlying problems with the tune. Again not implying that to be a problem your tune has or will have, just something you should keep in mind.

It will be good to see some strat times!
 

Cameron1292

Ready to race!
Location
Florida
The smaller value can lead to big problems. Afr is important if a tuner is using fuel to cover for kr there are other underlying problems with the tune. Again not implying that to be a problem your tune has or will have, just something you should keep in mind.

It will be good to see some strat times!
I totally agree. If I was seeing zero knock and low afr at this point in the process I'd be a little curious. But I am getting knock. No more now than I was in the beginning and as little as the afr has gone up, its still gone up. I havnt taken logs yet of my current revision I got yesterday so well see. The car pulls like a train and feels great on the daily. I have 2 hours of driving each day for work.

Sent from my ONEPLUS 5T using Tapatalk
 

railroader

Autocross Newbie
Location
Yuma Arizona
I don't have any experience tuning DI, but a decent amount with port injection, and minor AFR changes don't usually do much.

Personally I'd rather have it a bit fat, lose 5-10hp but keep the chamber and turbine temps lower.
I agree with this.

Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk
 

Cameron1292

Ready to race!
Location
Florida

marauder

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Northern Va
Running too rich can cause problems or mask other problems. But you'd have to be running significantly richer for that to happen. Running 11s vs running 12s is not a huge difference. AFR doesn't have a direct significant effect on overall power. It does play a role though with other values. Running leaner means hotter cylinder temps, hotter exhaust temps etc. By running slightly richer you can keep those temps down, which can allow for other changes like potentially increased timing, boost. Keeping the temps down can increase longevity and reliability.

My previous revision on a stock car had me at: (new tune is a bit leaner, just haven't logged)

93 octane
RPM 6000
AFR 11.02
Boost 22
Timing 6.5

Each tuner is going to have their own styles and techniques to achieve their goal. As well as each car is going to behave differently to tuning and mods. It is why you'll see 2 identical cars make different power on a dyno.
There is always going to be a trade off and a sweet spot. Going too high in a certain value can force you lower in another etc. It's about looking at it as a big picture and how they play together.


Nice video about AFR

Directly showing how AFR affects power:
https://www.hpacademy.com/courses/bare-minimum-tuning-knowledge/how-afr-affects-power/

Understanding how Fuel tuning works:
https://www.hpacademy.com/courses/bare-minimum-tuning-knowledge/understanding-fuel-tuning

Stratified Blog about AFR:
http://stratifiedauto.com/blog/does-a-leaner-air-fuel-ratio-result-in-more-power-on-the-mk7-gti/
 
Last edited:
Top