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License plate questions

cb1111

Newbie
Location
Virginia, USA
Pretty sure it has to do with fallout from 9/11. Generally, someone up to "nefarious deeds" does not abide by the law either through ignorance or apathy. Oklahoma City bomber Timothy McVeigh was caught because he did not have his license plate displayed correctly (no plate or not securely attached). Good way to catch these folks is by being strict with enforcement. Beyond that, it's also a good way for the District to collect revenue :D.
Yeah, I forgot about how they caught McVeigh, the guy killed 11 of my co-workers. I'm not sure that he didn't want to be caught - driving a beat up car without proper plates, registering at the motel under his name and renting the Ryder truck in his name.



License plate readers are becoming ever more common and there are Supreme Court decisions pending on fourth amendment violations of stopping a vehicle just because there is an issue with the registered owner. These stops are only generally possible if a license plate reader is used.


In any case, I suspect that traffic stops for no front plate will become more (not less) common.
 

MissedShifting

Passed Driver's Ed
Location
MD
I do know that DC meter maids have a cheat sheet listing those 19 states that don't require a front plate and I've seen cars booted for no front plates because they were not "legally registered". There is a reason for the strict enforcement in DC - Shorty, you want to explain it?

I drove my Acura Integra without a front plate in Maryland (which requires a front plate) for years. The only time I got a ticket for it was when I was parked in DC.
 

Corprin

Autocross Champion
Location
Magrathea
Car(s)
A car
Back in my day it was called a “pull me over and talk to me”

The best drug traffickers follow traffic laws, +\- 5mph of speed limit, get plenty of rest, drive non-descript common car models in boring colors, etc, all for the sake of blending in.

My last “big bust” was the idiot with 6lbs of packaged meth on the back seat running with expired tabs and a tail light out.
 

RichardCranium

Ready to race!
Location
Arizona
Pretty sure it has to do with fallout from 9/11. Generally, someone up to "nefarious deeds" does not abide by the law either through ignorance or apathy. Oklahoma City bomber Timothy McVeigh was caught because he did not have his license plate displayed correctly (no plate or not securely attached). Good way to catch these folks is by being strict with enforcement. Beyond that, it's also a good way for the District to collect revenue :D.

That's what he got pulled over for. He got arrested for having a concealed weapon. They didn't realize who he was until the FBI traced the truck's axle back to Ryder, who then got the name of the renter.

McVeigh wasn't a dummy. I think he just didn't give a fuck if he got arrested or not. He looked at it as a suicide mission.
 

shortyb

Autocross Newbie
Location
Upstate SC
Car(s)
Felon Taxi,Dad Wagon
That's what he got pulled over for. He got arrested for having a concealed weapon. They didn't realize who he was until the FBI traced the truck's axle back to Ryder, who then got the name of the renter.

McVeigh wasn't a dummy. I think he just didn't give a fuck if he got arrested or not. He looked at it as a suicide mission.

Picking nits, yes, he got pulled over for the plate violation which then started the ball rolling downhill for him. Point I was making that an astute cop was doing his job and pulled the car over for the simple act of not having a plate. No, didn't know who he was interacting with because of it, but shows there are a few officers out there that do enforce things like plate violations. Caveat tyrannis.

CB-forgot about the plate readers. We looked at them a few years back but shelved the purchase based partly on 4th Amendment violation potential and probability of administrative error on the part of the DMV. Neighboring jurisdiction took them off all their cars for the same reason. We still like to do things the old fashioned way.
 
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Strange Mud

Autocross Champion
Location
Small Town CT
Car(s)
Assorted
Back in my day it was called a “pull me over and talk to me”

The best drug traffickers follow traffic laws, +\- 5mph of speed limit, get plenty of rest, drive non-descript common car models in boring colors, etc, all for the sake of blending in.

My last “big bust” was the idiot with 6lbs of packaged meth on the back seat running with expired tabs and a tail light out.


you can't fix stupid.
 

RichardCranium

Ready to race!
Location
Arizona
Picking nits, yes, he got pulled over for the plate violation which then started the ball rolling downhill for him. Point I was making that an astute cop was doing his job and pulled the car over for the simple act of not having a plate. No, didn't know who he was interacting with because of it, but shows there are a few officers out there that do enforce things like plate violations. Caveat tyrannis.

Yeah, I wasn't trying to be a smart ass, I was just expanding on what you wrote. It was diligent police work that got him.

CB-forgot about the plate readers. We looked at them a few years back but shelved the purchase based partly on 4th Amendment violation potential and probability of administrative error on the part of the DMV. Neighboring jurisdiction took them off all their cars for the same reason. We still like to do things the old fashioned way.

Really?

They're all over the place out here in Arizona. We've even got repo companies running them. They mount them on any random car and then drive around large parking lots looking for delinquent cars to repo.
 

zinfamous

Go Kart Newbie
Location
MD
parking enforcement here (campus cops!) use plate readers on their patrol cars in the big lots and parking garages.

You do have to register your car if using parking pass or guest pass. Near the building where I work, I sometimes park in the metered guest lot where (well everywhere, actually), parking time is strictly enforced. There, at least, I don't have to worry about registering my tags, but of course I make sure to park front-in, so they don't know that I don't have a front tag.

I don't think it would make a difference in that lot, but most other lots, where passes are required, I think they would get out to check if they don't scan a front tag. Especially since you wouldn't expect a local-registered employee here to be driving in from a single-tag state.
 

cb1111

Newbie
Location
Virginia, USA
Picking nits, yes, he got pulled over for the plate violation which then started the ball rolling downhill for him. Point I was making that an astute cop was doing his job and pulled the car over for the simple act of not having a plate. No, didn't know who he was interacting with because of it, but shows there are a few officers out there that do enforce things like plate violations. Caveat tyrannis.

CB-forgot about the plate readers. We looked at them a few years back but shelved the purchase based partly on 4th Amendment violation potential and probability of administrative error on the part of the DMV. Neighboring jurisdiction took them off all their cars for the same reason. We still like to do things the old fashioned way.
Big discussion going on about fixed plate readers - a bit different from the mobile readers attached to the trunk of cars.

The fixed ones just suck up data and store it - something that is a privacy concern. In Fairfax Co, VA, each reader captured about 3600 plates an hour and it just went into a database.

Mobile ones are slightly different as they can not only read a plate, but can flag it if it finds violations.

Clearly, if there is a vehicle violation (expired tags for example) then there is no issue in pulling the car over as the plate reader is only doing what a cop could do - just far faster. The problem arises when the violation is based on the owner (suspended license for example or a warrant) and the vehicle is pulled over for that.

The Supreme Court is looking at just that - because the cop on the street would have never been alerted to that violation had it not been for the plate reader AND there is no indication that the driver is the individual with the violation or warrant.

One of these days they'll add facial recognition to plate readers to identify both the car and driver and then there be new issues.

An interesting little factoid from Germany (that they may have changed it by now).

The authorities only have a short time period to charge a driver for some moving violations (red light and speed cameras for examples).

It must be noted that Europe, in general, uses far more cameras for enforcement that we do here in the US. In Europe, photo tickets will also cause you to accrue points - a difference from most (all?) states here.

The authorities would send the registered the ticket.
The registered owner would respond with "I wasn't driving there that day"
Authorities " who is the person in the photograph in the driver's seat?
Owner "not sure, hard to tell"

After a few back and forths (via mail), the time period will have expired and the ticket no longer enforceable.

What people would do is to register their car in their significant other's name, so the wife's car would be photographed with the husband driving.
 
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RichardCranium

Ready to race!
Location
Arizona
They're wise to that, at least here in Arizona. I got a red light ticket in my fiance's car that was registered to her with my name nowhere near it. They cross referenced the address and sent the ticket direct to me.
 

Corprin

Autocross Champion
Location
Magrathea
Car(s)
A car
Big discussion going on about fixed plate readers - a bit different from the mobile readers attached to the trunk of cars.

The fixed ones just suck up data and store it - something that is a privacy concern. In Fairfax Co, VA, each reader captured about 3600 plates an hour and it just went into a database.

Mobile ones are slightly different as they can not only read a plate, but can flag it if it finds violations.

Clearly, if there is a vehicle violation (expired tags for example) then there is no issue in pulling the car over as the plate reader is only doing what a cop could do - just far faster. The problem arises when the violation is based on the owner (suspended license for example or a warrant) and the vehicle is pulled over for that.

The Supreme Court is looking at just that - because the cop on the street would have never been alerted to that violation had it not been for the plate reader AND there is no indication that the driver is the individual with the violation or warrant.

One of these days they'll add facial recognition to plate readers to identify both the car and driver and then there be new issues.

An interesting little factoid from Germany (that they may have changed it by now).

The authorities only have a short time period to charge a driver for some moving violations (red light and speed cameras for examples).

It must be noted that Europe, in general, uses far more cameras for enforcement that we do here in the US. In Europe, photo tickets will also cause you to accrue points - a difference from most (all?) states here.

The authorities would send the registered the ticket.
The registered owner would respond with "I wasn't driving there that day"
Authorities " who is the person in the photograph in the driver's seat?
Owner "not sure, hard to tell"

After a few back and forths (via mail), the time period will have expired and the ticket no longer enforceable.

What people would do is to register their car in their significant other's name, so the wife's car would be photographed with the husband driving.

Somewhere between Parsberg and Hohenfels a speed camera once captured a an image of 6 assholes wearing paper bag masks, flipping the bird.
 

cb1111

Newbie
Location
Virginia, USA
Somewhere between Parsberg and Hohenfels a speed camera once captured a an image of 6 assholes wearing paper bag masks, flipping the bird.
You and 5 others????? :p:p:p



I had an employee in Grafenwoehr who had an 18 year old son. Back in the 70's/80's, German public toilets at rest stops sold little packets of toilet paper to "pay" for the use of the stall, so it was common for drivers to carry rolls of toilet paper. Some people embroidered little pillows with their license plate numbers to cover the rolls and put them on the hat shelf in the back window.


One evening after a night of drinking, the 18 year old and some of his friends thought it would be funny to remove the license plates from the car and drive past a red light camera ten times in a row. He forgot about that pillow in the back.


Graf was the wild west back then, some Lieutenant thought it would be funny to rob the on-base bank and then booby trap his escape route. He forgot where one of the booby traps was and that took out the tires of his escape vehicle.
 
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