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IS38 1.8T Info/Discussion

George Smooth

George Smooth

Drag Race Newbie
Location
South Africa
wy2sl0 said:
Target or actual?

Target is around 150-160000. Actual was dipping to 80,000 because his meth was supplementing his fuel - not good :D

It never drops below 170,000 now with a 200,000 target (what I set). Safe on pump to 30+psi and around 26-27psi on E30 without any pressure issues.
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Target. We have seen the actual dipping down on the high power cars post gear shift.
 
W

wy2sl0

Drag Race Newbie
Location
Ontario
George Smooth said:
Target. We have seen the actual dipping down on the high power cars post gear shift.
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yup its about 30-40k less.

I strongly suggest anyone who mods their 1.8t to do this upgrade ASAP.
 
TwinDad

TwinDad

Autocross Newbie
Location
Fort Lee, NJ
George Smooth said:
Target. We have seen the actual dipping down on the high power cars post gear shift.
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George, How do the fp_h numbers convert to actual pressure. I have been looking back on my logs and I typically see the fp_h at 16-17. It will dip some, but doesn't look to go below 14. So does that mean my rail pressure is too high? Holding well but injectors are limited? or is it that I would benefit from the pump upgrade?
 
TwinDad

TwinDad

Autocross Newbie
Location
Fort Lee, NJ
wy2sl0 said:
Target or actual?

Target is around 150-160000. Actual was dipping to 80,000 because his meth was supplementing his fuel - not good :D

It never drops below 170,000 now with a 200,000 target (what I set). Safe on pump to 30+psi and around 26-27psi on E30 without any pressure issues.
Click to expand...

Can you fill me in more about the rail pressure dropping because the meth was supplementing? Why is it bad for the meth to add in the case of achieving more boost or power? Does the ECU read this as too much fuel and then reduces the pump pressure? Is it a case of too large of a nozzle? Sorry for all of the questions, but my WMI is going ion soon.
 
W

wy2sl0

Drag Race Newbie
Location
Ontario
TwinDad said:
Can you fill me in more about the rail pressure dropping because the meth was supplementing? Why is it bad for the meth to add in the case of achieving more boost or power? Does the ECU read this as too much fuel and then reduces the pump pressure? Is it a case of too large of a nozzle? Sorry for all of the questions, but my WMI is going ion soon.
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Correct, it is closed loop 100% of the time.

This means if you have an injector clog or meth nozzle failure and the ECU is currently pulling injector fueling to hit target lambda, you can go boom if you are over the limit - AFR is calculated in the exhaust housing as an aggregate reading of all four cylinders, so a major lean event in one would look like a minor event in aggregate calculation.

Methanol can allow you to go straight over your fuel limit and not even know - like Garetto was. It wasn't until he turned the meth off and on 3psi less than with the JB4 we realised he was out of fuel and going lean.

I'm not saying don't run meth, I am saying be educated on how it works and keep your car and wallet as safe as possible.
 
TwinDad

TwinDad

Autocross Newbie
Location
Fort Lee, NJ
wy2sl0 said:
Correct, it is closed loop 100% of the time.

This means if you have an injector clog or meth nozzle failure and the ECU is currently pulling injector fueling to hit target lambda, you can go boom if you are over the limit - AFR is calculated in the exhaust housing as an aggregate reading of all four cylinders, so a major lean event in one would look like a minor event in aggregate calculation.

Methanol can allow you to go straight over your fuel limit and not even know - like Garetto was. It wasn't until he turned the meth off and on 3psi less than with the JB4 we realised he was out of fuel and going lean.

I'm not saying don't run meth, I am saying be educated on how it works and keep your car and wallet as safe as possible.
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Thanks. So I need to watch the hpfp values on the JB4. Hopefully George will give me some inside on how the numbers translate. As it is, I'm at my fueling limit with being only JB4. I was hoping that the meth would allow me a few more psi. I was also considering upgrading to the gti hpfp. Not sure if it will help at all though. On the JB4, my fp_h values are 15-17. Trims can hit 51 if I push too hard and AFR will show that. The fp_h doesn't dip though. Is that then injector limit or pump limit?
 
George Smooth

George Smooth

Drag Race Newbie
Location
South Africa
TwinDad said:
Thanks. So I need to watch the hpfp values on the JB4. Hopefully George will give me some inside on how the numbers translate. As it is, I'm at my fueling limit with being only JB4. I was hoping that the meth would allow me a few more psi. I was also considering upgrading to the gti hpfp. Not sure if it will help at all though. On the JB4, my fp_h values are 15-17. Trims can hit 51 if I push too hard and AFR will show that. The fp_h doesn't dip though. Is that then injector limit or pump limit?
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If your FP_H is constant then your limitation is at the injector. If you going too lean you would have known about it by now the hard way although the JB4 will most likely switch to map 4 or you will get a B1S1 fault.
In general it is good practice not to use meth for fueling at all and at least test AFR with no meth running.
We are busy changing the profile of map 8 to hold more boost higher up the rpm range and this will be a safe solution for guys that are on the edge with meth. In map 6 you can also turn Meth safety to 4 and it will cut some boost when meth flow is not present if you using our FSB.
 
TwinDad

TwinDad

Autocross Newbie
Location
Fort Lee, NJ
George Smooth said:
If your FP_H is constant then your limitation is at the injector. If you going too lean you would have known about it by now the hard way although the JB4 will most likely switch to map 4 or you will get a B1S1 fault.
In general it is good practice not to use meth for fueling at all and at least test AFR with no meth running.
We are busy changing the profile of map 8 to hold more boost higher up the rpm range and this will be a safe solution for guys that are on the edge with meth. In map 6 you can also turn Meth safety to 4 and it will cut some boost when meth flow is not present if you using our FSB.
Click to expand...

OK. I have your full WMI kit with the FSB. I was trying to avoid the injector swap, but it looks like it's a must. At least we know the hpfp won't be limited any more. I would really like to see where I can go with JB4 only.
 
W

wy2sl0

Drag Race Newbie
Location
Ontario
DI injectors flow more based on fuel pressure.

If your duty is high, running more pressure will increase fueling. Start with the HPFP from the GTI/R.

Personally I suggest the APR HPFP at the same time as the swap to futureproof and avoid the need for MPI.
 
4MotionWagen

4MotionWagen

Ready to race!
Location
Michigan
wy2sl0 said:
P.S. I tuned the golf r that ran without exhaust last week on E40. He did 11.47@122.3mph and I would say that is mostly from gearing advantages over the DSG sportwagen. The discrepancy in power doesn't seem to be huge, but the resilience to failure is definitely lower.
I also tuned the is20gti that did 11.59@118 gutted with slicks. I don't see a Golf on 1.8t hitting those numbers on an IS20.
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Do you have a website for your tuning business or do I just send you a PM? I am interested in a custom tune in the future. I have Maestro and am getting a new HPFP and Golf R injectors.
 
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