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HPFP Auto tech vs APR

ladringan320

Ready to race!
Location
Marlton, NJ
Car(s)
me?
My question is... When looking at Auto tech or mabotech hpfp it looks like an injectors with springs in the pictures. But apr and racing line hpfp, the pictures are of what looks like a pump module(sorry I'm not tech savvy). Looking to get hpfp to run e40 but I'm not sure what I'm looking at and the other thread about hpfp and lpfp doesn't really answer my questions. Extra question, how will I know the fuel mixture?! Will I need a separate sensor? Thanks for any feedback.
 

Hoon

Autocross Champion
Location
Rhode Island
Autotech is internals, APR is an exchange program.

Autotech works awesome and is cheap. Install isn't too bad.

Which tuning solution are you using? HPFPs only make good sense for Cobb cars.
 

jiannu

Ready to race!
Location
Toronto
Autotech is internals, APR is an exchange program.

Autotech works awesome and is cheap. Install isn't too bad.

Which tuning solution are you using? HPFPs only make good sense for Cobb cars.
I've heard that doing that upgrade is not needed....I believe it does make a difference

Sent from my SM-N950U1 using Tapatalk
 

ladringan320

Ready to race!
Location
Marlton, NJ
Car(s)
me?
Autotech is internals, APR is an exchange program.

Autotech works awesome and is cheap. Install isn't too bad.

Which tuning solution are you using? HPFPs only make good sense for Cobb cars.

I'm with mabotech. Looking to run higher octane to squeeze a bit more power out of the car. I was thinking doing water and meth but ide prefer to install something alot simpler like a hpfp or lpfp, but not sure which is more beneficial.
 

aaronc7

Autocross Champion
Location
USA
Car(s)
17 S3
What's the quick and dirty about HPFP upgrade on cobb vs eurodyne or others? Only Cobb has the appropriate tables available to really maximize the hpfp potential? I understand MPI is going to be the way to go at some point.... but will HPFP alone allow let's say E50-E85 on IS38 at least?

Is the purpose of HPFP internals to increase pressure to reduce pulsewidth/duty cycle or simply to allow a greater fuel flow at around stock pressure without having fuel pressure dropping issues? In other words, what's the limit, injector or hpfp?
 

Diggs24

Autocross Champion
Location
de plains! de plains!
Car(s)
2015 GTI
Cobb has better control.
You can run E50 on an IS38 with HPFP with Cobb or Eurodyne. You can do full E85 with Cobb.


This explains it pretty well:

https://www.goapr.com/products/hpfp_20t_ea888_gen3.html

Injectors become a limit right around a full bore IS38 on E85 (or E50/60 on Eurodyne due to lack of pressure control on top end). Any bigger turbo would need at least an HPFP upgrade (preferably MPI).
 

aaronc7

Autocross Champion
Location
USA
Car(s)
17 S3
From what I understand one of Cobb's big advantages is the ability to widen the fuel injection window. I have Maestro and I definitely haven't seen anything like that on my car.

What specifically is the issue with Eurodyne and pressure control on the top end? I've seen it come up a few times in one of those big Eurodyne threads, but sometimes the info is so spread out it's hard to keep track lol.

I made a custom PID for approx injector duty cycle in my log review software, I think I just assumed a window of 360* which I know isn't correct and has a lot of variables (ign timing, intake/exhaust cam timing). Euro is missing a lot of those tables so I didn't have much good data to make an educated guess.
 

Hoon

Autocross Champion
Location
Rhode Island
From what I understand one of Cobb's big advantages is the ability to widen the fuel injection window. I have Maestro and I definitely haven't seen anything like that on my car.

What specifically is the issue with Eurodyne and pressure control on the top end? I've seen it come up a few times in one of those big Eurodyne threads, but sometimes the info is so spread out it's hard to keep track lol.

I made a custom PID for approx injector duty cycle in my log review software, I think I just assumed a window of 360* which I know isn't correct and has a lot of variables (ign timing, intake/exhaust cam timing). Euro is missing a lot of those tables so I didn't have much good data to make an educated guess.

You have a good understanding. HPFP control is complex and ED is just getting into it. I haven't messed with the new volume/stroke field yet but the issue was pressure spikes.

Keep in mind in your calculations that a DI injector has roughly half the time as a port injector to spray fuel.
 

aaronc7

Autocross Champion
Location
USA
Car(s)
17 S3
Yeah, from what I read on the internet, most DI engines have a window of around 320*. The window is from when the exhaust valve closes until spark, and I'm sure the ECU has some sort of buffer like, ensure end of injection is at least x degrees before spark etc. But I don't really know any of that data and I don't think ED can even log exhaust cam advance/retard so it's all a shot in the dark.

The equation for any other nerds is:

Max pw = [injection window max (deg)] / 6 / RPM
Duty cycle = [inj pw (ms)] * RPM * 0.6 / [injection window max (deg)]

ED stage 1.5 at 4300', at 6500 rpm I'm running 4.7 ms pw or ~ 57% duty cycle... in theory
 
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