Brake problems

burgerkong said:

I upgraded to Prosystem rotors and Endless ME22 pads. Haven't cooked my brakes yet and that's with 80TW semi slicks.

-Castrol SRF
-Yperion titanium shims
-SS lines
-RS3 ducts with trimmed brake shields
-Endless ME22 (had MX72 before as well)

My temp paint showed I went past 800C on my stock rotors whereas with the new rotors I hit 600C-ish. Directionally vaned and ventilation is very important, since the stock rotors have too much mass but not enough of an air gap for this type of punishment. It's great for longevity but not for cooling.

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Mini7 said:

Folks I do my best to provide unbiased feedback for track day use. Most definitely not my intention to mislead in any way shape or form. I use the stopwatch to judge the merits of mods. Reliability and safety are important factors to consider as well.

Not all vented rotors are created equal. Width, curved vanes, the metallurgy make-up of the rotors and the ability of the rotors to absorb heat. Rotors are the limiting factor not the calipers regarding brake performance. That was the point I was trying to make about the earlier post about the Porsche caliper.

I’m running a 330x32 4-Piston BBK. I do not consider a sliding caliper a BBK, even if it is running a 340x30mm rotor. The only reason why I am running a 330mm setup is because I have chosen to run 17” wheels to run 255 wide rubber. Tires will be your biggest performance variable to reduce lap time. I tend to focus on suspension and setup before adding power. I would prefer to run a 350 BBK setup for better heat management and longevity. A 6-piston caliper will only gain you longer pad life because of the larger pad area.

I digress, long story short, my 330x32 BBK runs cooler than my 340x30 PP with Pagid RSL 29’s ever did (i run RS3 air deflectors and had Ti heat shields on my PP) No fade, no boiling fluid or vapor lock issues like I had with my PP with Castro’s SRF. Verified by the temp strips I ran on the PP calipers. I dropped 2-secs off my laptime by compressing my brake zones.

PP brakes are marginally adequate at best for track work. An experienced driver will eventually outrun the capability of PP brakes. 25-30 minute track sessions would mean backing up a couple of brake markers because the rotors have become heat soaked and brake fade sets in. I ran PP brakes for two years on track. Depending on the track you can run hard for 5-6 laps and then need to back off in the brake zones. I’m on stock power.

Based on my application, PowerBrake recommended their 350x34 6-piston setup. Unfortunately it would not fit a 17” wheel so I chose there smaller BBK setup. Again its not about the number of pistons. Stoptech has a 355x32 4-piston setup Essex Parts has a 355x32 6-piston kit. For long term track work this is the way to go. More so if you have graduated to solo driving. The larger rotor has the capacity to absorb the heat. Wider rotor widths allows for better heat dissipation and cooling.

Don’t get me wrong, PP brakes work. You will need track pads and good brake fluid. RS3 air deflectors, Titanium heat shields. Brake fluid needs to be bled regularly. That has been my experience.

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burgerkong said:

Also better rotors. Anything less than Girodisc, Prosystems or Stoptech Aerorotors (if you can convince them to make a 340mmx30mm size) is asking for trouble. The stock rotors are too good at holding heat in and thusly overheating the pads, but shed heat very slowly.

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Mini7 said:

Folks I do my best to provide unbiased feedback for track day use. Most definitely not my intention to mislead in any way shape or form...

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burgerkong said:

Also better rotors. Anything less than Girodisc, Prosystems or Stoptech Aerorotors (if you can convince them to make a 340mmx30mm size) is asking for trouble. The stock rotors are too good at holding heat in and thusly overheating the pads, but shed heat very slowly.

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victorofhavoc said:

I would add racingbrake and dba to your rotor list.

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Mini7 said:

Not all vented rotors are created equal. Width, curved vanes, the metallurgy make-up of the rotors and the ability of the rotors to absorb heat. Rotors are the limiting factor not the calipers regarding brake performance. That was the point I was trying to make about the earlier post about the Porsche caliper.

I’m running a 330x32 4-Piston BBK. I do not consider a sliding caliper a BBK, even if it is running a 340x30mm rotor..

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Dybz said:

Thanks for clarifying.

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Dybz said:

DBA seems to be only ones with reasonably priced rotors out of this bunch, but I can't even find any 340mm for GTI. I dont think many of us can spring for $800 pair of rotors.

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victorofhavoc said:

The appeal of BBK becomes apparent when you price out buying pieces individually. 800$ for two piece rotors, 2k for something like the neuspeed 6pot caliper, 100$ for lines... Oh look the stoptech 355 kit is a similar price . Too bad it doesn't fit under 17s, lol.

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Cliff said:

Doing track days is not cheap, even in a Golf R or GTI.

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Cliff said:

Replacement rings for 355x32 rotors aren't cheap either at $345 per side for Stoptech rings and $300 per side for Girodisc rings. I don't have a feel for what my wear rate with the rotors will be like yet. I went through 4 sets of front rotors with the stock brakes.

Doing track days is not cheap, even in a Golf R or GTI. I am averaging 12-15 days per year. I go through a couple sets of front pads a year, replace the rear pads once a year, go through about 1 and a half sets of tires a year, change the oil twice a year (every 6 HPDE days), brake fluid once a year, other fluids at an accelerated pace, rotors, and whatever else.

I think about that, then think about what it would do to my finances to follow the same regimen with a Corvette, Porsche, or whatever, and I am glad to be pushing this Rabbit around a track.

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jmason said:

Can I hear an "Amen!" I'm at about $1300/weekend, everything (registration, track insurance, lodging, food, gas, car-related consummables, etc.) except depreciation considered.

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sean.mason.75873 said:

Is there a part number for the Pro Systems rotors? How much were they?

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

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burgerkong said:

I have a source selling for $650 a pair (race used though), new rings are $323 a side plus $85 a side for hardware. Oh and the hats. so yeah not cheap. And again, stating this for the record, the DBA 5000 series rotors that bolt on have kangaroo paw vanes (close to Brembo's pillar vane, ie not directional).

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