What did you do to your mk7 today?

[GTIfan99]

I wonder if there was a bad alignment on the non-pp one you drove. I just don't see how it could understeer so significantly more than the pp model (non DCC) if everything else was the same. So far, I haven't found my non-pp model to understeer that bad, and even some late braking brings the back end out a bit pretty effortlessly.

I still own the non-PP, my son drives it. When I took it to do a more aggressive autocross alignment, nothing was out of spec.

I'd guess the factory Hankook AS, no VAQ, and stock rear sway are why.

You have decent tires on your car, and while I've noticed at the limit, more grip equals more understeer balance, on the street you likely never exceed the grip of a decent set of tires, so you don't notice any understeer. The Hankooks would give up pretty easily and start to push.

Perfect example, my RE71Rs are just about done. On the street, I'd have to really push them beyond what safe to feel understeer, but trust me, it'll understeer.

 

[mrmatto]

I still own the non-PP, my son drives it. When I took it to do a more aggressive autocross alignment, nothing was out of spec.

I'd guess the factory Hankook AS, no VAQ, and stock rear sway are why.

You have decent tires on your car, and while I've noticed at the limit, more grip equals more understeer balance, on the street you likely never exceed the grip of a decent set of tires, so you don't notice any understeer. The Hankooks would give up pretty easily and start to push.

Perfect example, my RE71Rs are just about done. On the street, I'd have to really push them beyond what safe to feel understeer, but trust me, it'll understeer.

Father & Son Racing

 

[Dog Dad Wagon]

I actually have little to zero appetite for lowering the car. The ride is as stiff as I want it already.

Again, you and I are the same. I’ve owned 1 MK6 GTI and 2 Mk7 GTIs, all 3 of which spent their whole lives on bone-stock suspension.

I am actually going to LIFT my Alltrack suspension, lolz

 

[Dog Dad Wagon]

Most people don't drive their car hard enough to notice an improvement over the stock rear sway. For people that autocross, track, yes - for most: save your cash and go big turbo, that's the real difference you'll feel.

Lol this is wrong. You feel the difference in an RSB every time you turn the wheel. It affects turn-in + mid-turn modulation. You feel the stiffness of the chassis way more with a proper RSB. It makes any car more fun to drive in any/every situation. And an RSB is ~$200.

Big turbos are like a $5K investment considering Ic, intake, turbo, fueling, tune, and labor.

Mr nolsen, please don’t listen to Daks

 

[Dog Dad Wagon]

I can imagine the non-PP understeering a lot when you're trying to accelerate since there's no LSD. But other than that, I don't see why a non-PP would understeer more than a PP, all other things being equal. I've found my base GTI handles pretty flat and is competitive with the 3rd gen Mazda 3 that I recently sold, which was an excellent handler.

PP’s don’t “just” get bigger brakes and e-diff, they also get an uprated sway.

 

[mrmatto]

PP’s don’t “just” get bigger brakes and e-diff, they also get an uprated sway.

Where is the official source on that? Not doubting you, but I can't find any consistent confirmation on that. From what I can tell, it was the DCC package that had the bigger sway. I wonder if VW varied the packages throughout the 7/7.5 run.

 

[El_bigote_AJ]

I already had great tires and stiff springs… so when I did the rear sway bar is was very negligible at “turn in and mid turn in”

Only time it stood out was at fast speeds when I would left off mid turn/apex.


Front sway bar made a huge difference from the drivers seat for me.

 

[mrmatto]

PP’s don’t “just” get bigger brakes and e-diff, they also get an uprated sway.

Where is the official source on that? Not doubting you, but I can't find any consistent confirmation on that. From what I can tell, it was the DCC package that had the bigger sway. I wonder if VW varied the packages throughout the 7/7.5 run.

https://www.edmunds.com/volkswagen/golf-gti/2016/st-200751202/review/
the optional Performance package includes an electronically controlled mechanical limited-slip front differential, larger front and rear brakes and an additional 10 horsepower.

https://blog.moddedeuros.com/the-mk7-gti-performance-package-vs-the-non
This Performance Package comes with an additional 10 hp added to the turbocharged TSI engine, making the overall performance of the car 220 hp. In an addition to that the Performance Package comes with a VAQ (Vorderachsquersperre) front limited slip differential lock. It is an electrically controlled front axle transverse differential lock. The third addition in the PP is the upgraded front and rear brakes, similar to a big brake kit that is on the last-generation Golf R.

http://www.hallvw.com/blog/2017-volkswagen-golf-gti-s-vs-sport-vs-se-vs-autobahn/
Performance Package which adds an additional 10 horsepower and an electronically controlled mechanical limited-slip front differential and larger front and rear brakes, as well as, adaptive xenon headlights and keyless ignition and entry.

https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-ca...golf-gti-doesnt-get-any-more-power-in-the-us/
The Performance Package is still an option for 2018–now, it just consists of a front limited-slip differential and upgraded brakes.

https://www.autoblog.com/buy/2016-V...formance_Package_2_Door__2dr_Hatchback/specs/
etc. etc. etc....

 

[Daks]

Lol this is wrong. You feel the difference in an RSB every time you turn the wheel. It affects turn-in + mid-turn modulation. You feel the stiffness of the chassis way more with a proper RSB. It makes any car more fun to drive in any/every situation. And an RSB is ~$200.

Big turbos are like a $5K investment considering Ic, intake, turbo, fueling, tune, and labor.

Mr nolsen, please don’t listen to Daks

You don't feel it every time you turn the wheel, that makes absolutely no sense.

Most North American roads are bound by 90 degree intersections, your sway bar, unless you are tracking or auto crossing, isn't going to do much.

 

[Daks]

I already had great tires and stiff springs… so when I did the rear sway bar is was very negligible at “turn in and mid turn in”

Only time it stood out was at fast speeds when I would left off mid turn/apex.


Front sway bar made a huge difference from the drivers seat for me.

Exactly.

 

[Mr. Conundrum]

There are 3 different sway bar sizes for GTIs that I know of.

20mm Solid (Base GTI and later PP. 5QM511305C)
21.7mm x 3mm Hollow (PP without DCC and Clubsport. Might only be early years of PP. 5Q0511305AT)
21.7mm x 3.6mm Hollow (PP w/ DCC and Clubsport S bar. 5Q0511305BA)

 

[Dog Dad Wagon]

You don't feel it every time you turn the wheel, that makes absolutely no sense.

Most North American roads are bound by 90 degree intersections, your sway bar, unless you are tracking or auto crossing, isn't going to do much.

No. that’s simply untrue ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I feel it every single time I turn the wheel on my car. No matter how many degrees - I feel the difference.

 

[Daks]

No. that’s simply untrue ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I feel it every single time I turn the wheel on my car. No matter how many degrees - I feel the difference.

 

[GTIfan99]

Father & Son Racing

He did when he was younger, but he's on a carrier and too busy lately.

 

[GTIfan99]

You don't feel it every time you turn the wheel, that makes absolutely no sense.

Most North American roads are bound by 90 degree intersections, your sway bar, unless you are tracking or auto crossing, isn't going to do much.

With sticky tires, you're right 90% of the time.

The other 10% of the time, you're wrong.

Lol.