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Vibrations

aloha_from_bradley

Go Kart Champion
Location
AZ
I'm chasing my tail.

2019 R w/ 12.5k

Hit a pothole on the passenger side a couple months ago. Wheel was ever so slightly bent. Sent out for repair, came back good. Alignment performed, perfectly in spec. Suspension looked at by dealership, nothing found.

About a month later I happen to notice light vibrations at highway speeds. Usually between 70-90 MPH. Yes, you can drive that fast in Phoenix just about anywhere.

Take the car into the dealership - road forced all 4 wheels & tires. Two tires don't pass the road force. No indication of a bad wheel from the results.

Next, I buy a full set of new tires - Firehawk Indys - Road force balance all 4 new tires. Here are the results:

Left Front: .014
Right Front: .005
Left Rear: .015
Right Rear: .010

So as you can tell, the balance came in way under the acceptable range for a road force (under 20 lbs). I'm about 99.99999 % sure I don't have a wheel or tire issue. I've checked the front wheel bearings for abnormal noise, grinding sounds, humming, noticeable play, etc. I can't find anything. There is no "steering wander" or any other measurable issue to speak of either. Still getting vibrations, but only at highway speeds. Under 70 MPH the car is perfect.

Where do I look next?
 

Golfs everyday

Autocross Newbie
Location
USA
Do you have a friend that can lend you their wheels? I would swap the 4 wheels and tires and see if that helps. Then you know it's your wheels. Numbers are good as a guide but real world can work in strange ways.

Also, does the vibration behavior change if you change the driving mode (damp setting)? If so, it can be your dampers or even mounts.
 

aloha_from_bradley

Go Kart Champion
Location
AZ
Do you have a friend that can lend you their wheels? I would swap the 4 wheels and tires and see if that helps. Then you know it's your wheels. Numbers are good as a guide but real world can work in strange ways.

Also, does the vibration behavior change if you change the driving mode (damp setting)? If so, it can be your dampers or even mounts.

This is a really great idea. Not sure why I didn't think of this. Appreciate the advice.
 

Al_in_Philly

Drag Racing Champion
Location
Philadelphia USA
How are you tightening your lug bolts? When VW went to the MQB platform, in order to shed a few ounces of weight, they started using tapered hubs. These hubs drastically reduce the length of the contact area between the hub and wheel. If a wheel is torqued down incorrectly (as with an air wrench) it can be affixed to the hub slightly off center. This has been the cause of high speed vibration on many MK7/7.5 Golfs since they came out--especially when fitted with aftermarket wheels using hub-centric rings, which often aren't deep enough to mate up with the hub at its full diameter. Progressively torquing the wheel bolts to 88.5 ft/lb (120 Nm), often eliminates the vibration. I hope that helps.
 

aloha_from_bradley

Go Kart Champion
Location
AZ
How are you tightening your lug bolts? When VW went to the MQB platform, in order to shed a few ounces of weight, they started using tapered hubs. These hubs drastically reduce the length of the contact area between the hub and wheel. If a wheel is torqued down incorrectly (as with an air wrench) it can be affixed to the hub slightly off center. This has been the cause of high speed vibration on many MK7/7.5 Golfs since they came out--especially when fitted with aftermarket wheels using hub-centric rings, which often aren't deep enough to mate up with the hub at its full diameter. Progressively torquing the wheel bolts to 88.5 ft/lb (120 Nm), often eliminates the vibration. I hope that helps.

This is really great advice. I've had really bad experiences with the dealership torquing studs down to the point where I can barely get them off. I actually take the wheels off of my car and bring them into the shop when I get new tires and install the wheels back onto the car myself. I also "rotate" my own wheels to prevent scratching and other issues with install, so I'm definitely aware of what you are speaking to. I tend to torque my wheels a little higher, usually 90-100 lb/ft. Never had an issue. But to answer your question, yes... I understand your feedback and this is something I'm aware of. This definitely is not my issue. I really do appreciate your insight, though.
 
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jimlloyd40

Autocross Champion
Location
Phoenix
Car(s)
2018 SE DSG
This is really great advice. I've had really bad experiences with the dealership torquing studs down to the point where I can barely get them off. I actually take the wheels off of my car and bring them into the shop when I get new tires and install the wheels back onto the car myself. I also "rotate" my own wheels to prevent scratching and other issues with install, so I'm definitely aware of what you are speaking to. I tend to torque my wheels a little higher, usually 90-100 lb/ft. Never had an issue. But to answer your question, yes... I understand your feedback and this is something I'm aware of. This definitely is not my issue. I really do appreciate your insight, though.

Just curious why you over torque?
 

aloha_from_bradley

Go Kart Champion
Location
AZ
Just curious why you over torque?

I've used 90 lb ft as a standard for a long time. The wheels are no good if they come off 🙂.

In all seriousness, I feel as if the studs are just too easy to remove under 90. If 88 is what VW calls for then it's perfectly fine, but the couple extra lbs are really just piece of mind more than anything.
 
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ice raptor

Passed Driver's Ed
Location
WI
Double check your hub rings and see if you get play from them. The bump could have knocked one of them out enough to cause it not to sit perfectly flush. the plastic ones just tend to be junk IMO But if it moves at all on the hub with the wheel you are gonna get some vibration.
 

aloha_from_bradley

Go Kart Champion
Location
AZ
Double check your hub rings and see if you get play from them. The bump could have knocked one of them out enough to cause it not to sit perfectly flush. the plastic ones just tend to be junk IMO But if it moves at all on the hub with the wheel you are gonna get some vibration.

I thought you only needed hub rings if you planned to run a wheel with a different sized center bore? I have the stock Pretorias on my car. Not sure what you mean by "check the hub rings."
 

jimlloyd40

Autocross Champion
Location
Phoenix
Car(s)
2018 SE DSG
I thought you only needed hub rings if you planned to run a wheel with a different sized center bore? I have the stock Pretorias on my car. Not sure what you mean by "check the hub rings."

If you're running stock wheels or even aftermarket that are hub centric you wouldn't have hub centric rings.
 

Brad.R

New member
Location
Austin, TX
Car(s)
2018 Golf R
+1 for torquing to spec, preferably in a star pattern. I have aftermarket wheels, but went through 3 different sets of hub rings and still got vibration. Had all 4 wheels balanced twice, was pulling my hair out. Finally I removed them at home and tightened with a torque wrench by hand instead of a shop air wrench and it's been fine ever since.

If I ever take the car somewhere that the wheels will be off, I'm gonna be "that guy" that has them put them back on by hand, but the car really does seem that sensitive to it.
 

aloha_from_bradley

Go Kart Champion
Location
AZ
+1 for torquing to spec, preferably in a star pattern. I have aftermarket wheels, but went through 3 different sets of hub rings and still got vibration. Had all 4 wheels balanced twice, was pulling my hair out. Finally I removed them at home and tightened with a torque wrench by hand instead of a shop air wrench and it's been fine ever since.

If I ever take the car somewhere that the wheels will be off, I'm gonna be "that guy" that has them put them back on by hand, but the car really does seem that sensitive to it.

I do the same. Like I said earlier in the thread, I go as far as just taking the wheels off the car to bring them in for tires. Definitely also torque in a star pattern. I'm very picky to say the least ;)
 
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