Street Touring Hatchback (STH) discussion/setup

[DerHase]

So now the functional question is..
Does someone make a spacer plate? - a garage brew solution seems sketchy.

Otherwise I think just some fender washers on the bottom side of the strut tower, between it and the plate? At only 1/4”-3/8” maybe I could make something from aluminum plate? I would have to do it all by hand. I can’t seem to find anything online right off. But this is all new to me so I might not have the right terms or idea.

It would really just be a flat plate. You could take a strut mount and effectively trace it out onto a sheet of paper and then use that as a template to drill the holes and cut it out of 1/4in steel or aluminum.
Definitely don't want to just stick washers under there - That'll deform the strut towers almost for sure.
These 1in lift spacers could be machined down very easily.

https://www.vwliftkits.com/spacer-kits.html

 

[DerHase]

@mrmatto not sure what a FMIC does in an autocross setting... but heat soak is a very real problem even with the DO88

Had a lot of fun at the first TSCC autocross of the year. This was my first time autocrossing in about 5 years (I may have done one event in there randomly in someone else's car?). Got the win in our ST* PAX class overall.

I was absolutely hating the front sway bar and/or the tires for the first two runs. It was chilly and the car was all over the place. Once it got some heat in the tires it stopped understeering then oversteering like hell. Runs 4 and 5 felt fantastic. #4 I hit a cone and I think I drove just a bit faster on the first half of the course, but #5 was where I was able to knock out a 39.9xx whatever.

There was a big showing of MK7s from the VB MQB group as well so the club had a trophy glass pre-made for them coming out.. so I left with two



Tire pressures I started out at like 29/29 when cold, was all over the place. Runs 2 and "3"(because red flagged I got a rerun) it was still skatey at 32/31psi when bled down so I kept lowering it for my rerun #3, and a bit lower for my 4th + 5th/final run. Settled on 29/27 and really liked it. Rollover was not bad at all.

 

[mrmatto]

@mrmatto not sure what a FMIC does in an autocross setting... but heat soak is a very real problem even with the DO88

FMIC works well at autocross for a few runs then starts to heatsoak badly. If there is a stiff breeze and the car is face-first into it, then the IC works a lot better — actually stays fairly consistent. Kinda supports the theory of using a leaf blower between runs . But I don’t think there’s enough to be gained from that on most autox courses.

 

[krs]

FMIC works well at autocross for a few runs then starts to heatsoak badly. If there is a stiff breeze and the car is face-first into it, then the IC works a lot better — actually stays fairly consistent. Kinda supports the theory of using a leaf blower between runs . But I don’t think there’s enough to be gained from that on most autox courses.

Two summers ago on a handful of events I tested various methods of hood up, hood down, spraying, not spraying, leaf blower, no leaf blower.

Very un-scientific really, and the numbers logged really didn’t show any value in doing one method or the other for me.

Sure the leaf blower allowed slightly cooler IAT’s at the grid, but everything else was pretty consistent after about 10-15 seconds into a run. I’m not an elite racer chasing hundredths or thousands of a second for a win. So I’ve opted for a less busy grid session, and really that’s okay for me.

I guess when I move to Las Vegas this month we’ll see if I need to adjust.

 

[mrmatto]

Two summers ago on a handful of events I tested various methods of hood up, hood down, spraying, not spraying, leaf blower, no leaf blower.

Very un-scientific really, and the numbers logged really didn’t show any value in doing one method or the other for me.

Sure the leaf blower allowed slightly cooler IAT’s at the grid, but everything else was pretty consistent after about 10-15 seconds into a run. I’m not an elite racer chasing hundredths or thousands of a second for a win. So I’ve opted for a less busy grid session, and really that’s okay for me.

I guess when I move to Las Vegas this month we’ll see if I need to adjust.

Yeah I’m not in favor of adding more things between runs. I already have to adjust tire pressure, check the catch can, possibly spray tires, and sometimes fuss with the camera. Adding a leaf blower is a no-go lol. I just pop the hood and leave the car running (so the radiator fans blow) and that seems to be as good as I can get. I figure everyone else in grid is getting heatsoaked too so whatever lol.

 

[xXDavidCXx]

Welp...ffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff
What are my options here? I'm missing maybe 1/4" of camber. I'm not sure what that will end up being degree wise but I'm atleast a tiny bit salty that I can't use the whole range.
This is on my new RedShift Kit.
View attachment 277299

14.8
C.
The following allowances apply to strut-type suspensions. Adjustable
camber plates may be installed at the top of the strut and the original
upper mounting holes may be slotted. The drilling of holes in order to
perform the installation is permitted. The center clearance hole may
not be modified.


So basically nothing I can do from the sound of it.
While I could potentially drill holes to get to the camber adjustment screw the damper adjustment knob would still sit too high by like 1/8"

This is the number one reason I don't like this shock.

And you still don't have enough camber.

 

[00Zero]

looks like vorshlag had the same issue; https://www.vorshlag.com/forums/for...on/7362-mcs-rr2-install-on-mk3-audi-tt?t=8511

 

[Roald]

I emailed Redshift and Chris got back almost immediately saying that the issue was not predicted and offered to make and send me an appropriate spacer. " A a space (5-10mm) under the camber plate (above the shaft) to move the camber plate up higher on the shock shaft. That will lower the adjuster" - So it sounds like I have a solution incoming and I'm grateful to Chris and crew for doing this.

Driving around yesterday and today I'm finding that even mild bumps or manhole covers cause the front suspension to crash aggressively- Its an incredibly loud pop or thud. I knew the ride would be more stiff, but this is unexpected for the spring rates (8kF/10kR)- and now I'm questioning if I set the preload correctly. I suspect I did not. I only raised each corner and set it to "just hand tight". Which I think is not enough and is causing the strut to bottom out. I'll be adjusting that tonight.
- Sorry I also sort of double posted this in the suspension install guide. I just didn't want it to go un-updated. Redshift is working to get me fixed up on the spacer.

 

[DerHase]

Well, guess I'll be testing 255s vs 245 V730s. Want a bit more bite up front and these are cheap on Amazon so I snagged a pair of them:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B088K6C1YP?ref=ppx_pt2_mob_b_prod_image

Going to try a reverse stagger setup. Will probably buy another pair of wheels so IF we ever hold a test and tune, I can try that back to back.

The plan is to use the 255/245 setup for autocross, and swap to 245 square on track (so that rotating between days can be done).

 

[xXDavidCXx]

Videos from the Las Vegas National Tour

These are from the day two battle between me and my co-driver Thomas Bennett.

Day one was mostly me and Tom getting used to the car and the fast offset course. We definitely left time on the table, but I was able to put down a flyer on my last run but hit a (dumb) cone keeping me in second place.

Day 1
Tom 58.227
Me 59.269 (1.042 back)

Day 2 after 1st runs
Tom 52.598
Me 52.063 (0.535 ahead on day two, but 0.507 behind combined)

Tom's second run was 51.921 so I needed about a 50.8 run to be able to beat the time deficit from day 1 plus Tom's second run. To be honest, I'm not sure I've ever come back from such a deficit, ever.

Both of us were gaining confidence in the car and ourselves as we kept beating each other's times.

Day 2 after 2nd runs
Tom 51.921
Me 50.581 (1.34 ahead on day two, and 0.298 ahead combined)

Tom's third run.

Tom drops 1.845 seconds and leaves me in a tight spot needing me to get a 49.0 to take the win overall

I gain on Tom's 3rd run with a 49.963 to win day two and 5th in pax for the morning heat, but it was not enough for the overall win.

I was happy for Tom and was bummed that I hit that dang cone on day one, but overall it's a win for the car, which further confirms my setup. Tom loved the car, and said he'd rather drive the GTI over the Focus he normally co-drives.

Here you can see use side-by-side on our day two third runs. It's interesting to see the lead trading through the elements. Generally, Tom was faster before the sweeper and me after the sweeper.

 

[bfury5]

Welp...ffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff
What are my options here? I'm missing maybe 1/4" of camber. I'm not sure what that will end up being degree wise but I'm atleast a tiny bit salty that I can't use the whole range.
This is on my new RedShift Kit.
View attachment 277299

14.8
C.
The following allowances apply to strut-type suspensions. Adjustable
camber plates may be installed at the top of the strut and the original
upper mounting holes may be slotted. The drilling of holes in order to
perform the installation is permitted. The center clearance hole may
not be modified.


So basically nothing I can do from the sound of it.
While I could potentially drill holes to get to the camber adjustment screw the damper adjustment knob would still sit too high by like 1/8"

somewhere in this thread are the pictures of the access holes I drilled for mine.

edit: found the original picture, here ya go

 

[bfury5]

I emailed Redshift and Chris got back almost immediately saying that the issue was not predicted and offered to make and send me an appropriate spacer. " A a space (5-10mm) under the camber plate (above the shaft) to move the camber plate up higher on the shock shaft. That will lower the adjuster" - So it sounds like I have a solution incoming and I'm grateful to Chris and crew for doing this.

Driving around yesterday and today I'm finding that even mild bumps or manhole covers cause the front suspension to crash aggressively- Its an incredibly loud pop or thud. I knew the ride would be more stiff, but this is unexpected for the spring rates (8kF/10kR)- and now I'm questioning if I set the preload correctly. I suspect I did not. I only raised each corner and set it to "just hand tight". Which I think is not enough and is causing the strut to bottom out. I'll be adjusting that tonight.
- Sorry I also sort of double posted this in the suspension install guide. I just didn't want it to go un-updated. Redshift is working to get me fixed up on the spacer.

fwiw I found that the pillow ball bearings on the camber plates got a little quiet as the wore in. It looks like you have the newer "Standard" kit and not the BC-based one, so the plates are probably different. I had some crashing like that initially, but most of it went away once I re-tightened the bolts between the body and the top mount. Also, making sure the nut at the top of the camber plate is tight. that compresses the entire bearing + spring seat stack on the shaft, and can cause noise if there isn't adequate compression. I trust Chris + co. in this department to have assembled it right, but always good to check too.

I'd also be very surprised if you're bottoming out the front at those rates, regardless of preload settings.

 

[MonkeyMD]

Well. Getting used to being a little more aggressive on the newish tires.

Needed better than 30.634 to win STH (out of 3). Final run, even though I overdid it in first section and was correcting and didn't get as fast as one of my worse runs (60 vs 63 mph), ended with a 30.620
Ended up with 36 front, 40 rear tire pressures. on this surface, a differential of 4 gives me good rotation but not oversteery. Could proabably stand to go 42 in the rear or actually get a real suspension setup, but that's not happening.

There was only 1 Golf Faster. A Golf R in STU with a 29.9. I'll take it.

 

[Roald]

What are, or is there a camber solution for 62mm ID coil over springs? I believe these are still just BC racing springs.

My Redshift/Standard Camber plates still clunk pretty harshly over street imperfections even after having the street valving added and 5k-f/7k-r springs.
I recognize I may have to give up the "easy" camber of having plates. But -to me- this is not streetable.

Or maybe there is a way to dampen the noise from these plates? A rubber pad or something to separate the plate directly from the shock tower.

 

[xXDavidCXx]

What are, or is there a camber solution for 62mm ID coil over springs? I believe these are still just BC racing springs.

My Redshift/Standard Camber plates still clunk pretty harshly over street imperfections even after having the street valving added and 5k-f/7k-r springs.
I recognize I may have to give up the "easy" camber of having plates. But -to me- this is not streetable.

Or maybe there is a way to dampen the noise from these plates? A rubber pad or something to separate the plate directly from the shock tower.

I'm really surprised at your situation.

The issue could be related to the top bearing. Was it easy to articulate/move by hand before instillation?

If so, the bearing could just have loose tolerances.