Should I trade my Evo for an R? Driving myself insane, and would love some input.

[Noize1]

A little background first.

I'm one of the site administrators over at evolutionm.net. I've had mostly Evos since 2003, when they first came to the states. I've owned five of them: an VIII, an IX, and three Xs. During that time, I also had a short term 335i lease, a 135i and a Mk6 GTI. My GTI build thread on golfmk6 is here, in case anyone is interested: http://www.golfmk6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=56221

I didn't have the mk6 very long, mostly because it was an open diff base model manual car, and I never really loved it. Ultimately, I tried to make it handle, and it seemed a lot more work than it was worth to accomplish. With zero launches ever, the clutch started slipping with 10k on the odometer, about 1500 miles after I upgraded from APR s1 to APR s2, which was pretty lame. The modifications I did to it increased the harshness a lot, but didn't help it handle anywhere near as well as the Evo did. I traded it in on my current 2013 Evo X four years ago, and hadn't looked back, until recently.

Early this spring, it was time to get a new car for my wife, and I recommended a mk7 GTI. We got her a 2017 SE with the DSG, and she really likes it! I like it too, it kicks the crap out of my old mk6 in every measurable way: Interior is way nicer, DSG is flat out better, more power, faster, better stereo, leather, bigger brakes, VAQ differential better than nothing, yada yada yada.

My Evo is paid off, doing great, has only 28k miles, but driving her GTI has me pining for an R. I would really want a 2017, because Pretorias, CarPlay, and actual USB connection instead of that crappy-proprietary-VW-craptastic-connection-crap on the 15s and 16s.

My daily grind is real estate, and having the extra room of a hatchback and literally doubling the fuel economy has me really interested. I'm 44 years old, and while admittedly some of this might be because her car is new, when we go somewhere as a family, I will take the keys to her car 10/10 times.

I went to my local dealer, and they offered me KKB Very good for my car at $25,500. My car is paid off, and I figure with selling the coilovers, wheels, and a few other things, I can easily get $4500-$5000 in cash to put toward this.

They have two Rs locally, one is a new black manual, and the other a red manual 2017 CPO'd car with 850 miles on it for $37,000. I really tried to like the red manual, but the paint is not in good shape at all for it's age, and I really, really hate red. I'm also sick of black cars, but the main problem with them is the transmission. Even though I've driven manuals exclusively for the past 20+ years, the R clutch is feather light, and looking at the forums, the same pile of crap the mk6 GTI and R had, which can't handle any torque. I want a DSG, and think I would regret the manual horribly.

I also figure that it's ok to be picky about color. Blue is my top choice, followed by white. I don't want another black car, I hate red, and I despise that grey-with-a-hint-of-champagne limestone vomit or whatever it's called.

Thanks for letting me vent and share all of that, here are my questions:
1) Can I do better than $1000-$1500 off sticker on a new 2017 DSG R within 200 miles of Nashville, TN?

2) Am I just going to regret this again? Meaning because I will be taking a huge handling hit (and potential) going from a modified X to an R, but I haven't been on a track with turns in years, and not sure I care anymore.

3) Have any of you guys/gals gone from an Evo to an R and are very happy about it?


Thanks again!

 

[Noize1]

If I get an R, plans would be to keep stock suspension, but get camber plates or something so I can dial in an extra degree of negative camber up front to get it to like -2.0. I'd run slightly more aggressive rubber like Michelin PS4S, and do a downpipe + tune + maaaaaaybe an intercooler, and just enjoy the car for many years.

 

[Urlik]

Get the DSG (and I have a manual).

 

[MDLBC]

Check this video out:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ImobeCtRphc

 

[Al_in_Philly]

It sounds like you may have outgrown your Evo, and if that's so, an R might be a solid next step. Understand, that an R isn't as visceral as your Evo, however it does perform amazingly well--it just does it effortlessly, without drama, like a good German. Some feel that this makes the R less exciting; I (and others) find it amazingly satisfying. Here's a tip when driving an R: when you start to feel the front end beginning to push, just give it more gas--that's how the Haldex likes to be driven hard, as the more you push (on the street) the better it feels. Crazy car, that way.
With the R, you'll be taking a huge step forward with build quality, as you've probably noted in your wife's GTI. It's grown up in ways which Mitsubishi simply couln't manage. That's not to say that your Evo wasn't fun as Hell, but it, like the Focus RS, is more of a one trick pony, which struggles out of its element.
To me, the R is perfect for somebody who's moved beyond his boy-racer days and wants a more sophisticated adult car, but still can't resist the urge to act a bit of the hoonagan every once in a while, either.
One more thing: when I bought my R in 2015, there wasn't an option to get it with a manual transmission; the R I got was the first automatic in my life. It's really good. It's the transmission which the car was built to have. But, obviously, it's not more fun--how could it be? Now, if you can hold off until the Mk7.5's come, you can get a DSG with 7 speeds, which must be killer. Waiting a little longer will also snare you the new dashboard and a few other features, which is something to think about.
My two cents.

 

[jw1989]

Just noticed on FB that you are just down the road from me, so thought I would chime in on the price part of your question. I was really impressed with Cool Springs VW. Just purchased a 17 GTI Sport DSG and was able to get it for less than the Atlanta dealers. I negotiated the GTI price first and then brought in the trade at the last minute. They also gave me KBB retail (good condition) for my trade which needed tires. Murfreesboro was 3k more (1k on the GTI and -2k on the trade).

A great way to get a starting price for new is to use a "spam" email address and get quotes via truecar from different areas of the country. They matched the D.C. area truecar prices. I didn't need a new car and was willing to walk if I didn't get the price I wanted. Also bought it on the last day of June.

Obviously the R is a completely different story as far as pricing.

Did you see the blue R DSG they had a couple weeks ago? I "think" it was a 2016.

Good luck on making your decision.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[The Fed]

Where did you get the idea 2017's are better than the 2016's? I have USB.

Don't EVO's ride like crap even stock? With a DCC R you can have the best of both worlds.

 

[nate704]

OP, I can hook you up with my sales guy at Stohlman VW at Tysons Corner, VA.
He will beat YOUR price!
PM me your contact info, and I will have him to call/text you tonight.

 

[Noize1]

Check this video out:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ImobeCtRphc

Have seen it, thanks. That's a 2015 Evo, so no Recaros. Super unfortunate. I don't like the Focus RS at all- Owners have experienced RDU shutdown in heat, they're popping head gaskets out in the wild, and they're languishing on dealer lots at $42k and above. Evo X or R for me for sure.

It sounds like you may have outgrown your Evo, and if that's so, an R might be a solid next step. Understand, that an R isn't as visceral as your Evo, however it does perform amazingly well--it just does it effortlessly, without drama, like a good German. Some feel that this makes the R less exciting; I (and others) find it amazingly satisfying. Here's a tip when driving an R: when you start to feel the front end beginning to push, just give it more gas--that's how the Haldex likes to be driven hard, as the more you push (on the street) the better it feels. Crazy car, that way.
With the R, you'll be taking a huge step forward with build quality, as you've probably noted in your wife's GTI. It's grown up in ways which Mitsubishi simply couln't manage. That's not to say that your Evo wasn't fun as Hell, but it, like the Focus RS, is more of a one trick pony, which struggles out of its element.
To me, the R is perfect for somebody who's moved beyond his boy-racer days and wants a more sophisticated adult car, but still can't resist the urge to act a bit of the hoonagan every once in a while, either.
One more thing: when I bought my R in 2015, there wasn't an option to get it with a manual transmission; the R I got was the first automatic in my life. It's really good. It's the transmission which the car was built to have. But, obviously, it's not more fun--how could it be? Now, if you can hold off until the Mk7.5's come, you can get a DSG with 7 speeds, which must be killer. Waiting a little longer will also snare you the new dashboard and a few other features, which is something to think about.
My two cents.

2018 might be worth the wait. I would get those hideous new wheels and lose the Pretorias, but I could replace them eventually.

 

[Noize1]

Just noticed on FB that you are just down the road from me, so thought I would chime in on the price part of your question. I was really impressed with Cool Springs VW. Just purchased a 17 GTI Sport DSG and was able to get it for less than the Atlanta dealers. I negotiated the GTI price first and then brought in the trade at the last minute. They also gave me KBB retail (good condition) for my trade which needed tires. Murfreesboro was 3k more (1k on the GTI and -2k on the trade).

A great way to get a starting price for new is to use a "spam" email address and get quotes via truecar from different areas of the country. They matched the D.C. area truecar prices. I didn't need a new car and was willing to walk if I didn't get the price I wanted. Also bought it on the last day of June.

Obviously the R is a completely different story as far as pricing.

Did you see the blue R DSG they had a couple weeks ago? I "think" it was a 2016.

Good luck on making your decision.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Hey man! Small world. I have bought a lot of cars out of that Hallmark dealer, including my current Evo at their Rivergate location.

We got my wife's SE at that Cool Springs Hallmark earlier this year. They gave us a smoking deal on her trade, and dropped like $3500 off sticker on the GTI. Sadly, the R is a different animal. Since they come from Germany, their cost on them is high, they are rare, and VW isn't giving anywhere near the money back to the dealers on them. In fact, I don't think they are giving any incentives to the dealers on the R at all.

I did see and drive that launch edition 2015 blue R at Hallmark. They still have it, just have moved it back to the other store. That car is really pretty rough. The paint is bad, the leather wasn't very cared for, and it's too used. My car is two years older, and in way better shape.

Where did you get the idea 2017's are better than the 2016's? I have USB.

Don't EVO's ride like crap even stock? With a DCC R you can have the best of both worlds.

They are better to me. I didn't realize on the USB, so thanks for that. Do you have CarPlay, or is that a 2017 only thing? Also, I thought the Pretorias are only on 2017, because every 2017 I've seen have them. I think the Cadiz wheels are hideous.

Stock Evos don't ride like crap at all. They ride similar to the R, just have a way higher handling limit. The place where the Evo sucks is the lack of interior quality, lack of cargo, and fuel economy. The R slays in that regard.

OP, I can hook you up with my sales guy at Stohlman VW at Tysons Corner, VA.
He will beat YOUR price!
PM me your contact info, and I will have him to call/text you tonight.

Thanks homey, sending you contact info!
Edit: Not sure how a trade would work. I've heard bad things about VA and modified cars.

 

[TheWombat]

2016s have CarPlay/Android Auto, yes.

 

[Noize1]

2016s have CarPlay/Android Auto, yes.

Thanks, I'll update my search parameters. I'd just have to get those Cadiz off fast.

 

[RennWerks]

Nota bene: WRT the 7-speed DSG, yes, the new 7-speed DSG could be sensational provided the revised gearing closes the gaps (so to speak) in the current DGS gearing, but how do we know that VW hasn't geared the car for the Bonneville salt flats, with an ultra long 7th gear for fuel economy? Imagine how disappointing it would be to own an R that constantly seeks the highest gear among seven?

Oh, and Noize, I could be a buyer for your unwanted 2018 alloys (not the Cadiz).

 

[KASPER1]

Nota bene: WRT the 7-speed DSG, yes, the new 7-speed DSG could be sensational provided the revised gearing closes the gaps (so to speak) in the current DGS gearing, but how do we know that VW hasn't geared the car for the Bonneville salt flats, with an ultra long 7th gear for fuel economy? Imagine how disappointing it would be to own an R that constantly seeks the highest gear among seven?

Oh, and Noize, I could be a buyer for your unwanted alloys.

Well, the 18 gets worse mpg than the 17. So it would seem that there is no worry or benefit of the 7th gear mpg wise. That's curious to me as the 6speed dsg seems pretty tight to me ratio wise already but time will tell soon enough

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/Find.do?action=sbs&id=37915&id=38913&id=38912&id=37916

 

[The Fed]

Well, the 18 gets worse mpg than the 17. So it would seem that there is no worry or benefit of the 7th gear mpg wise. That's curious to me as the 6speed dsg seems pretty tight to me ratio wise already but time will tell soon enough

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/Find.do?action=sbs&id=37915&id=38913&id=38912&id=37916

Surprising. I don't think the gear rations on the 6-speed DSG are too far apart. Do we know what the gear ratios and final drive ratio are on the 2018?

If the 7-speed DSG can take more power I would definitely wait for the 2018. And if you like high-tech you'll also get the digital dash and I think pedestrian detection. What the wheels look like would be my last concern. Cadiz grew on me after a few months. I like Pretoria's less now. And they seem harder to keep clean.