MK7 Climatronic upgrade with instructions and pictures.

[Cuzoe]

Following up on my earlier post. I thought I'd figured out how to get the recirc flap to function correctly with a coding change, but the result was the recirc mode being reversed from what's indicated on the Climatronic panel! My windows were fogging up in cold weather even with the A/C on (mostly when the whole family was in the car), so I finally looked up into the cabin filter slot to confirm. I switched the coding back to original even though that means it's not 100% fresh when in that setting.

I think we (meaning budget retrofit Climatronic folks) will have to accept some recirc flap wonkiness, because the servo and wiring is different on factory Climatronic cars. (Why did VW do this for recirc and defrost servos?! I'd think those things would function the same for both HVAC types.)

This is the wiring diagram for the Climatronic recirc servo, which has 4 wires and is identified as V425 (with G44 position sensor):

...

Meanwhile, manual HVAC cars have 2 wires to a servo named V113:

...

What I don't get is that I can read the recirc door position in VCDS even with the 2-wire servo. But it appears that a different servo and additional wiring are needed for full compatibility. Anyone found something different?

There's a non-zero chance I'll be going back to my manual HVAC until such time as I do full climatronic retrofit. I've got the touch climatronic panel installed, although I don't know if that is making a diffeernce.

The HVAC is all over the place with directing air. When I leave it in Auto it seems to be hunting flap positions. I'll get air blowing on my face, then feet, then upper (defrost) vents, then back, all pretty random. Until last week I had not needed to defrost but when I select Max Defrost it's giving me what I think is a mix of air on my face and from the upper (defrost vents). The front window did de-fog so air is going up there but it certainly isn't right. I haven't even logged the position of the recirc flap but I have to assume it has the same issue everyone (who is looking) is seeing.

The temperature regulation is quite good (have both vent, the foot and sun sensor installed). I also have the air quality sensor installed and it did switch to recirc mode one day as I got back into the valley where the air quality generally sucks (it's bad enough that we get the alerts on our phones).

If everything (besides dual zone, obviously) worked I could live with the various faults. But since it doesn't my inclination is go back to manual. HVAC is the only module in my scan with faults... or at least with faults I didn't induce and therefore cannot resolve.

 

[jaysen71581]

Hello not sure to stay on this thread or not however, I did the climate touch retrofit from ali express and the only issues i have is that the AC compressor doesnt turn on, i can touch the button for it however it doesnt light up and the clean air button doesnt work, thats not a big deal id much rather have AC though. I have followed the advice in other threads about holding down the ac button and rear defroster button then both lights blink however when i go to hit the ac button it doesnt come on. Here are the codes ive pulled from VCDS in the controller if anyone can point me in the right spot. I did copy the coding from my original unit and that didnt really make any difference from just plugging it in without any coding.
00020004200110000000000000000006
Thursday,18,January,2024,11:56:02:34089
VCDS Version: Release 23.11.0 (x64) Running on Windows 11 x64
www.Ross-Tech.com

Address 08: Auto HVAC Labels: 5G0-907-044.clb
Control Module Part Number: 17G 907 044 L HW: 17G 907 044 L
Component and/or Version: AC Automat H11 1201
Software Coding: 00020004200110000000000000000006
Work Shop Code: WSC 00000 000 00000
ASAM Dataset: EV_ACTouchPrehVW37X 001010 (VW37)
ROD: EV_ACTouchPrehVW37X_VW37.rod
VCID: 3365286182B041090E-8066
Fault Codes have been Erased

No ASAM data for: "EV_ACTouchPrehVW37X" (VW37)
6 Faults Found:
328197 - ROD - Unknown Error Code
- 00 [00001001]
Confirmed - Tested Since Memory Clear
Freeze Frame:
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Reset counter: 141
Mileage: 153127 km
Date: 2024.01.18
Time: 11:55:29

328965 - ROD - Unknown Error Code
- 00 [00001001]
Confirmed - Tested Since Memory Clear
Freeze Frame:
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Reset counter: 141
Mileage: 153127 km
Date: 2024.01.18
Time: 11:55:29

329477 - ROD - Unknown Error Code
- 00 [00001001]
Confirmed - Tested Since Memory Clear
Freeze Frame:
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Reset counter: 141
Mileage: 153127 km
Date: 2024.01.18
Time: 11:55:29

329989 - ROD - Unknown Error Code
- 00 [00001001]
Confirmed - Tested Since Memory Clear
Freeze Frame:
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Reset counter: 141
Mileage: 153127 km
Date: 2024.01.18
Time: 11:55:29

524545 - ROD - Unknown Error Code
- 00 [00001001]
Confirmed - Tested Since Memory Clear
Freeze Frame:
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Reset counter: 141
Mileage: 153127 km
Date: 2024.01.18
Time: 11:55:29

328453 - ROD - Unknown Error Code
- 00 [00001001]
Confirmed - Tested Since Memory Clear
Freeze Frame:
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Reset counter: 141
Mileage: 153127 km
Date: 2024.01.18
Time: 11:55:29

 

[bobloblawGTI]

There's a non-zero chance I'll be going back to my manual HVAC until such time as I do full climatronic retrofit. I've got the touch climatronic panel installed, although I don't know if that is making a diffeernce.

The HVAC is all over the place with directing air. When I leave it in Auto it seems to be hunting flap positions. I'll get air blowing on my face, then feet, then upper (defrost) vents, then back, all pretty random. Until last week I had not needed to defrost but when I select Max Defrost it's giving me what I think is a mix of air on my face and from the upper (defrost vents). The front window did de-fog so air is going up there but it certainly isn't right. I haven't even logged the position of the recirc flap but I have to assume it has the same issue everyone (who is looking) is seeing.

The temperature regulation is quite good (have both vent, the foot and sun sensor installed). I also have the air quality sensor installed and it did switch to recirc mode one day as I got back into the valley where the air quality generally sucks (it's bad enough that we get the alerts on our phones).

If everything (besides dual zone, obviously) worked I could live with the various faults. But since it doesn't my inclination is go back to manual. HVAC is the only module in my scan with faults... or at least with faults I didn't induce and therefore cannot resolve.

Alright you've convinced me not to do this... first time @Cuzoe has ever saved me money!

 

[Cuzoe]

Alright you've convinced me not to do this... first time @Cuzoe has ever saved me money!

You're very welcome... don't you think your car needs the AC outlet that the GSW's have in the hatch though .

On topic... I don't ever change the temp from 74 degrees now, and that has been the same since summer when I did this right through the "cold" of SoCal winter. But I never messed with the manual HVAC all that much except fan speed which is real easy to switch. I was more interested in the fact that the touch HVAC "rounded out" my interior... 9.2" MIB screen, AID, capacitive steering wheel buttons.

 

[Kushdaiin]

You're very welcome... don't you think your car needs the AC outlet that the GSW's have in the hatch though .

Number of days since GSW purchase: 637
Number of times AC Outlet has been used: 0

 

[Cuzoe]

Number of days since GSW purchase: 637
Number of times AC Outlet has been used: 0

I don't limit retrofits to things I'm going to use . Today I ordered the OEM trailer hitch kit. Got a good deal because it's been discontinued and my local dealer said they aren't allowed to return it to VW.

Have I ever connected anything to the hitch I installed? Nope!
Would I ever tow anything? Absolutely not!
May never even get the bike rack on there.

 

[blackgold]

Hey. The answer might be buried in here but I'm missing it. I am installing the AliExpress unit now and I'm trying to in in the sensor. I keep seeing use pins 13 and 17. My plug has 1-16. I don't have a pin 17. Thanks!
Brian

 

[Belthasar]

@Goodbar, thanks for following up with your experiences, and for looking into differences in the wiring diagrams for manual vs Climatronic units. I find that to be very intriguing and I have the same head-scratching question - why would there be two different servos, depending on whether the car was equipped with Climatronic?

It looks like the blue and yellow wires are analogous to black/white and gray/white on V425, but what could those extra three wires on V425 connect to? Is it possible that climatronic units have some sort of logic to automatically control recirculation, depending on certain sensor input? I'd be interested to know: on V425, what do red/white, purple, and brown connect to? Any unused pins on the climatronic control panel?

I wonder how hard it is to replace that servo. Actually, I'm wondering how many of them would be necessary for an entire retrofit. Some of them seemed to be within easy reach if I recall when I was wiring the sensors up. I imagine adding/replacing one or two of the climatronic servos would require a full dashboard disassembly, however.

Thanks for reporting this. I don't think I'll bother trying to install the Jetta climatronic panel, as it doesn't seem like it would make any difference in getting recirc to function properly.

@Cuzoe, your experiences are interesting (hunting for the correct flap position, etc.). I had two strange occurrences since I did this retrofit where ALL flaps were closed and no air was escaping. This happened during a 95 degree F day and my family was roasting, and randomly on a cool Fall morning. Not ideal. I don't know how I got the flaps to release; I can't remember if fiddling with the manual controls for a few minutes did it, or if a power cycle/restart of the car did it.

I do agree though, that with the temp sensors properly placed, this partial retrofit does modulate temperature quite well. Given what I'm seeing here and what I myself have experienced, for those following this thread and thinking about it, I wouldn't recommend doing this partial retrofit until we figure out a fix

 

[Cuzoe]

@Belthasar I "talked" @bobloblawGTI's ears off in a private conversation that ended up with me mostly ranting about this half retrofit. And a lot of ways I was working through my thoughts there and I'll post in here with my thoughts work-ed through.

In brief, because I'm on my phone and don't have the wiring diagrams handy... I don't don't think it makes any difference if we use one or both temp sensors unless they are wired in parallel (which they or may not make the module upset, although I thought somebody did that and it didn't cause any problems). Ultimately, our issue is that a car with climatronic can direct air to three places at once. Our car can only do two.

This is an obvious observation of course. But the way that it's implemented in the HVAC unit (the physical unit, not the module) is our big problem.

With edits this post is becoming less and less brief. But have considered a full retro fit and the dash has to come out. I seem to recall there was something that it didn't look like you could get to without the whole thing removed.

Then once you have the whole dash out it happens that a full unit would be less expensive than buying the additional servos/parts individually. I have the OEM climatronic harness already. It was shockingly inexpensive like, 45 bucks or something.

And then I started to wonder whether the three zone from a Tiguan would fit. I haven't ran that down yet completely but I strongly believe it would (would mean buying a Tiguan harness, or adding the additional wiring to the harness I bought already). The touch climatronic panel has the adaptations for and is capable of controlling three zone. It's a Tiguan part number and mine was set for 3 zone when I got it. I'm not sure about the non-touch climatronic panel.

 

[Jachas]

I didn't checked entire topic, but form last pages I see that everyone have problem with recirc flap. From my little research on ETKA and schematics, Anyone tried to swap 2 pin V113 to 5pin V425 with G644 position sensor? Because in manual A/C recirc flap has only 2 positions (open/close), but with Climatronic recirc flap, apart from open/close positions, climatronic can put the flap between open/close positions, partially closing recirc flap for better air filtration (AirCare mode, AFAIR), that's why climatronic requires recirc flap with position sensor.

It looks like the blue and yellow wires are analogous to black/white and gray/white on V425, but what could those extra three wires on V425 connect to? Is it possible that climatronic units have some sort of logic to automatically control recirculation, depending on certain sensor input? I'd be interested to know: on V425, what do red/white, purple, and brown connect to? Any unused pins on the climatronic control panel?

red/white - Pin 7 in black 16 pin connector (signal wire)
purple - Pin 1 in black 16 pin connector, common with other 5pin V428 and V68 flaps (power, 5V probably)
brown - Pin 14 in black 16 pin connector, common with G308 V428 and V68 (ground)



Recirc flaps are different between manual and climatronic, with different parts numbers between Denso and Valeo HVAC, and different V425 beetween them too

Valeo climatronic:

5Q0907511A superseded by 5WA907511C
5Q0907511L superseded by 2Q0907511F

Denso climatronic:

5Q0907511A superseded by 5WA907511C

Visually on ETKA, Valeo recirc flaps seems to look the same (at least on schematic) in manual and Climatronic (especially on Valeo), so maybe the only difference is V113 instead of V425 (hence different part number for recir flap)
Denso has extra module of gears and levers 5Q0898141B or 5Q0898141C. It is possible to retrofit this module to manual A/C recirc flap? I dunno, hard to guess

 

[Cuzoe]

So I made a spreadsheet that I won't post (yet, maybe never) because my notes are not easy to follow, but in (really long) “summary”...
- I should note I have two of these "half retrofit" harnesses and they are both wired the same
- Concerns, we'll call them, are bolded.

Manual HVAC V68 - Temp Control Door Motor <===> Climatronic V158 - Left Temp Control Door Motor
- This is wired correctly, through the retrofit harness.

Manual HVAC G92 - Temp Control Door Motor Position Sensor <===> Climatronic G220 - Left Temp Control Door Motor Position Sensor
- This is wired correctly, through the retrofit harness.

Manual HVAC V428 - Air Distribution Motor <===> Climatronic V426 - Front Air Distribution Motor
- The 0% and 100% (to the motor) portion of this is wired correctly, through the retrofit harness.
- Position sensor for this is also wired correctly through the retrofit harness.

Manual HVAC V113 - Recirculation Door Motor <===> Climatronic V425 - Fresh Air/Recirc/Back Pressure Door Motor
- The 0% and 100% motor wires are switched as they go through the retrofit harness (consistent on both the retrofit harnesses I have)
- I assume this is wrong since the Temp Control and Distro Motor doors are wired straight through.
- I stress, this is an assumption, maybe there’s a reason for this (though I have not logic-ed my way through a good one).


Manual HVAC cars are missing the following, and so we have the expected faults...
G107 - Sun sensor - this can be added to clear the fault (sensor has a left and right output, potentially helps with temp regulation)
G151 - Right Vent Temp Sensor - this can be added to clear the fault (but does nothing since we have no second, right side, temp zone)
V159 - Right Temp Door Control Motor
G221 - Right Temp Door Control Motor Position Sensor
G238 – Air Quality Sensor – Optional via coding, though I did install this
G644 – Fresh Air/Recirc/Back Pressure Door Motor Position Sensor
- This is the position sensor on Climatronic V425, which in manual cars is actually V113 Recirculation Door Motor, that has no position sensor.
- This is likely the reason for my (our) weirdness with recirc. In a manual car the HVAC would learn/adapt the motor stops but in Climatronic the HVAC would also know the position.
- As an aside I need to read up on what the “back pressure” part of this means/does
V107 – Defroster Door Motor
G135 – Defroster Door Motor Position Sensor
- Lack of these is why max defrost is almost worthless (at least in my car)
- I am retrofitting the heated windshield which theoretically reduces my max defrost needs, but this is still the driving factor for me going back to my manual HVAC.

Effectively the Climatronic system is dual temperature zones and with 3 independent air flow zones (any combination can be selected). Manual HVAC is a single temperature with 3 airflow zones (of which only 2 can be selected at a time).


Blah blah blah… what it all means in my opinion (I’m open to all thoughts… contrary, clarifying and/or concurring)
1) There’s no point in adding the other vent sensor since we only have one zone.
2) The sun sensor is not a bad addition, as I assume it aids temp regulation and/or fan speed.
3) Air quality sensor optional, but it does work, my car has gone into recirc mode auto-magically.
4) Fresh Air/Recirc may never work 100% but close enough might be okay.
- Why both my harnesses have the 0/100% switched is unknown, may not matter and/or may not be the case in your harness… anyone want to check?
5) I don’t see how air flow zones can be properly controlled.
- Manual HVAC’s distribution door motor is now acting as the front distribution door motor only… so where in Climatronic this is just face or feet, in our cars this can be face/feet/upper (windshield) depending on where the flap sits.
- Manual HVAC has no defrost (windshield/upper) door motor at all so air is only directed there inadvertently (uncontrolled, if you will)
- Ultimately air flow is all over the place in my car, always hunting in Auto. If I manually direct flow I there’s no hunting but it doesn’t necessarily match what I’ve selected (although sometimes it does, indicative of the Climatronic panel not really knowing where the flap is positioned).
6) Everything in (5) means defrost performance is… degraded let’s say. If I choose max defrost the fans go max, as expected. And airflow hunts position, including the upper/windshield vents so the glass does de-fog, but not quick enough that I’m comfortable with it.

 

[Jachas]

G644 – Fresh Air/Recirc/Back Pressure Door Motor Position Sensor
- This is the position sensor on Climatronic V425, which in manual cars is actually V113 Recirculation Door Motor, that has no position sensor.
- This is likely the reason for my (our) weirdness with recirc. In a manual car the HVAC would learn/adapt the motor stops but in Climatronic the HVAC would also know the position.
- As an aside I need to read up on what the “back pressure” part of this means/does

"Back pressure" feature is described in SSP339 (Passat B6, page 68) as function to maintain same air flow to cabin, independently from car speed. (Vent speed is regulated too, if needed)
I cannot find in which SSP has that info, but MQB with climatronic has AirCare mode, that uses humidity and interior + exterior temp sensors to close the recirc flap to allow more cabin air to flow through the cabin filter for better filtration of in car air (but not to allow for interior fogging/misting of windshield)

Blah blah blah… what it all means in my opinion (I’m open to all thoughts… contrary, clarifying and/or concurring)
1) There’s no point in adding the other vent sensor since we only have one zone.
2) The sun sensor is not a bad addition, as I assume it aids temp regulation and/or fan speed.
3) Air quality sensor optional, but it does work, my car has gone into recirc mode auto-magically.
4) Fresh Air/Recirc may never work 100% but close enough might be okay.
- Why both my harnesses have the 0/100% switched is unknown, may not matter and/or may not be the case in your harness… anyone want to check?
5) I don’t see how air flow zones can be properly controlled.
- Manual HVAC’s distribution door motor is now acting as the front distribution door motor only… so where in Climatronic this is just face or feet, in our cars this can be face/feet/upper (windshield) depending on where the flap sits.
- Manual HVAC has no defrost (windshield/upper) door motor at all so air is only directed there inadvertently (uncontrolled, if you will)
- Ultimately air flow is all over the place in my car, always hunting in Auto. If I manually direct flow I there’s no hunting but it doesn’t necessarily match what I’ve selected (although sometimes it does, indicative of the Climatronic panel not really knowing where the flap is positioned).
6) Everything in (5) means defrost performance is… degraded let’s say. If I choose max defrost the fans go max, as expected. And airflow hunts position, including the upper/windshield vents so the glass does de-fog, but not quick enough that I’m comfortable with it.

1. Only for less errors in 08 control unit (but connecting one temp sensor for left and right inputs in contol unit should do the same)
2. Can do both, lower the temp and add air flow to maintain proactivly (before interior gets hotter from heat)
3.G238 (5Q0907643C) is ok (Air quality), but if retroffiting, it can be retrofitted and coded for G935 (Air quality and exterior humidity) like in euro B8 Passat/Skoda Superb or A3 8V (4H0907658D). Wiring is the same for both(3 wires, +/- and LIN)
4.Lack of position sensor of recirc flap might be a bigger problem for climatronic, but why this china retrofit wiring have switched signals for V113? No idea

 

[Cuzoe]

"Back pressure" feature is described in SSP339 (Passat B6, page 68) as function to maintain same air flow to cabin, independently from car speed. (Vent speed is regulated too, if needed)
I cannot find in which SSP has that info, but MQB with climatronic has AirCare mode, that uses humidity and interior + exterior temp sensors to close the recirc flap to allow more cabin air to flow through the cabin filter for better filtration of in car air (but not to allow for interior fogging/misting of windshield)

I have heard about aircare mode, and also seen the clean air button on climatronic panels from places outside of NAR. I don't believe any NAR MK7s even got AirCare mode. From the factory, we don't even have the pre-filter under the rain tray.
This is not difficult or expensive to add... https://www.golfmk7.com/forums/index.php?threads/cabin-filter-new-pre-filter-option.338432/

1. Only for less errors in 08 control unit (but connecting one temp sensor for left and right inputs in contol unit should do the same)

True. And in all cases whatever temp is set on the left side is what you will get. Does not matter if you "sync" or not.

2. Can do both, lower the temp and add air flow to maintain proactivly (before interior gets hotter from heat)

Good to know. This is not much work or expense to add. Would be nice to see it included with a kit.

3.G238 (5Q0907643C) is ok (Air quality), but if retroffiting, it can be retrofitted and coded for G935 (Air quality and exterior humidity) like in euro B8 Passat/Skoda Superb or A3 8V (4H0907658D). Wiring is the same for both(3 wires, +/- and LIN)

Correct, I picked up and installed 4H0 907 658 D. And the wiring for this sensor (G238, item 5 in the picture), can be tied right to the refrigerant circuit pressure sensor harness (G805, item 3 in the picture).
- Note that the Air Quality/Humidity sensor sits right above the pre-filter that NAR cars do not have. It clips into plastic body that holds that filter. I don't recall if the mesh there from the factory has a place to hold the sensor.

4.Lack of position sensor of recirc flap might be a bigger problem for climatronic, but why this china retrofit wiring have switched signals for V113? No idea

It's a mystery to me. I may swap them just to see what difference (if any) it makes.

 

[Kushdaiin]

3.G238 (5Q0907643C) is ok (Air quality), but if retroffiting, it can be retrofitted and coded for G935 (Air quality and exterior humidity) like in euro B8 Passat/Skoda Superb or A3 8V (4H0907658D). Wiring is the same for both(3 wires, +/- and LIN)

Having Climatronic, going from the 5Q0907643C to the 4H0907658D is a plug and play mod, with a little bit of coding to tell the 08 module that it's there?

 

[Cuzoe]

Having Climatronic, going from the 5Q0907643C to the 4H0907658D is a plug and play mod, with a little bit of coding to tell the 08 module that it's there?

This thread is not a place for factory climatronic elites... But it is the same plug, so yes .