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Hub Centric Rings and Vibrations

daymoon

Passed Driver's Ed
Location
Portland Oregon
Car(s)
2017 GTI Sport
Hey all,

Been tackling a vibration issue on my wheel set up for some time now (felt from 65ish to 80 mostly in pedal and floor), and wanted to get some opinions. After going through nearly every damn thread on this topic, I found what could possibly be my issue (I think).

I found some threads mentioning that the hub centric rings and the lug tightening procedure may be a culprit. I had until recently the ones that tirerack sent, theyre a black Gorilla brand thats hollow plastic, doesn't meet at the end of the taper. I also tried progressive tightening in the air from 10-75 lb pounds, then put on ground tighten to 90 lb pounds.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00DIK4G4A/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I ordered these, put them on, 2 were quite looses on the hub and the other 2 I had to tap into place as they were very tight. The rings I had on originally were those supplied by tirerack, they're a hollow plastic Gorilla brand that I've read are iffy.

I'm looking for a 72.6 to 57.1 ring to go with, as I believe this may be the culprit. I heard BFI is a decent recommendation but haven't heard anything other than a few people talk about them.

https://blackforestindustries.com/c...meter-72-6-internal-diameter-57-1-set-of-four

Are there any other recommendations?

Also to note, I'm running Motegi MR131 and DWS06+ tires, had them rebalanced about 3-4 times now. Cars in alignment, no shop has mentioned tires being out of round, most recent rebalance was 2 weeks ago. Only thing to mention is wheel weights (inconsistent quality from Motegi Im guessing)

FL wheel: 3oz
FR wheel: 2.5oz
LR wheel: 7 oz
RR wheel: 6 oz


Thanks for your help guys!
 

daymoon

Passed Driver's Ed
Location
Portland Oregon
Car(s)
2017 GTI Sport
No spacers, and I haven't tried without the rings yet, though I can only imagine it'd make the issue worse. Figure it wouldn't hurt to try as it's a free way to diagnose.
 

GolfRRRR1

Go Kart Champion
Location
Michigan
Make sure the hub centric rings you buy are at least 10-12mm deep, because if they are only 5 or 6mm deep they will sit too far inside and "float" up to 1mm causing a vibration.
 

golfdave

Autocross Champion
Location
Scotland (U.K.)
Car(s)
Mk7 Golf GT Estate
When I got my MK7 in late 2014 I had problems with normal hub centric adaptor rings & back then nobody was making proper deep metal rings...so I had to get a set specially machined up with a deep collar as that "olive" on the hub ring is a PITA!!...
 

daymoon

Passed Driver's Ed
Location
Portland Oregon
Car(s)
2017 GTI Sport
Make sure the hub centric rings you buy are at least 10-12mm deep, because if they are only 5 or 6mm deep they will sit too far inside and "float" up to 1mm causing a vibration.
Right, the ones I bought from amazon were listed at 10 mm, still they all had inconsistent figments between all the hubs.

Curious if the BFI one is good however, I read somewhere that they were designed with th is in mind?
 

Salami

Autocross Champion
Location
North Carolina
Car(s)
MK7.5R
Hey all,

Been tackling a vibration issue on my wheel set up for some time now (felt from 65ish to 80 mostly in pedal and floor), and wanted to get some opinions.


Only thing to mention is wheel weights (inconsistent quality from Motegi Im guessing)

FL wheel: 3oz
FR wheel: 2.5oz
LR wheel: 7 oz
RR wheel: 6 oz


Thanks for your help guys!
While the hub centric rings could be a factor the amount of weight on the rear two tires is excessive. It points to out of tolerance wheels or tires, an out of calibration tire balancer, wheels mounted incorrectly on balancer, or a mismatch in high/low spots of the wheels and tires.

Vibration in the floor board and pedal area point to vibration coming from the rear tires/wheels.
 

daymoon

Passed Driver's Ed
Location
Portland Oregon
Car(s)
2017 GTI Sport
While the hub centric rings could be a factor the amount of weight on the rear two tires is excessive. It points to out of tolerance wheels or tires, an out of calibration tire balancer, wheels mounted incorrectly on balancer, or a mismatch in high/low spots of the wheels and tires.

Vibration in the floor board and pedal area point to vibration coming from the rear tires/wheels.
That’s what I’d read about the rear wheels causing pedal and seat vibrations.

Something I noticed, I had a full car yesterday with passengers (5 of us total) and the car drove noticeably worse on the freeway, more vibrations.

Today on the way to work, same deal (with just me). Either it’s in my head or having more weight in the car caused something to happen.
 

GolfRRRR1

Go Kart Champion
Location
Michigan
Your tires should probably be dismounted, clocked and then re-balanced because as Salami stated, way too many weights on the back wheels. New tires have paint dots Yellow and Red. Yellow is the lightest area of the tire, it should be mounted near the heaviest part of the wheel (by the valve stem). Red is for something else, but if there is a red dot, put that near the valve stem (heaviest part of the wheel. Mounter could have gotten distracted? Look for the dots to see if they did it correctly.
 

daymoon

Passed Driver's Ed
Location
Portland Oregon
Car(s)
2017 GTI Sport
Your tires should probably be dismounted, clocked and then re-balanced because as Salami stated, way too many weights on the back wheels. New tires have paint dots Yellow and Red. Yellow is the lightest area of the tire, it should be mounted near the heaviest part of the wheel (by the valve stem). Red is for something else, but if there is a red dot, put that near the valve stem (heaviest part of the wheel. Mounter could have gotten distracted? Look for the dots to see if they did it correctly.

It’s what I’d asked discount tire to do when I was there last, dismount rotate and rebalance. I got home and it looks like they just did a typical rebalance ugh should have followed up with them there. Think it’s time to find another shop to go to.

Don’t think the dots are on my tire anymore but I can double check.
 

daymoon

Passed Driver's Ed
Location
Portland Oregon
Car(s)
2017 GTI Sport
Update:

A couple things, I guess I messed up counting the wheel weights for the rear wheels, the actual values are

LR: 6.5 -> 5.0 oz
RR: 6.0 -> 7.75 oz!

I ended up switching the two back hub rings with the ones I purchased off Amazon, though I purposely used the two that were snug, bordering on tight on the hub. Retorqued using 10-30-60 90 on ground.

Took it for a 5 min spin and it’s noticeably better, got it up to 90 briefly and could still feel something, but way better than before. I may still need to get the RR rebalanced but am uncertain about the LR. Will update again on extended highway driving.
 

rye0pa

Go Kart Newbie
Location
NJ
I have this same issue also on montegi wheels. My spacers are metal and seem to fit snug in all 4 wheels. I have had them balanced 3 times with 1 of them being road force balanced. All were said they be fine. Have General gmax summer tires on them. Which need to be replaced this spring. The vibration is in the same speed range as yours. I am hoping that it is the tires and this spring it will be rectified with a tire change. I will follow thread as I am curious to see how you make out.
 

Roald

Go Kart Champion
Location
Ohio
Car(s)
GTI mk 7 2017
I chased a similar issue,.
bought Konig HyperGrams and mounted my already used Conti Extreme Contacts to them.
bought Konigs plastic centering rings.
bought a good 1/2" torque wrench and used the proper method of tightening. Star pattern in increments up to about 50 lbs. Then lower tire to make contact with the ground enough to not spin and send it home.

I had a vibration at 60+ felt like it was the back wheel. swapping wheels/rings around didn't seem to move the perceived location. I assumed it was a rim. I had my cousin ( a master honda mech ) mount/balance my tires.
Still I had the balance re-checked at a local tire discounters. No adjustments were made and very little weight was used on any of the wheels. In fact only 3 of them required any weight at all. Nothing was bent, wheel bearings are okay, bushings are okay.
No changes. still have a vibration.
I then bought another set of plastic rings from Amazon.
Still vibrating.
Finally I bought a set of metal rings from Amazon, applied anti seize on them very carefully ( you don't want it on the hub face ).
- Metal Rings fixed my issued.

I went through two sets of rings before I found some that didn't vibrate.
I understand that an alternative might be switch to studs / nuts. It centers the wheel different since the studs are static and the nuts now have enough play to "pull" the wheel into correct alignment. I'm not sure how true this is but it seems reasonable. That said good stud conversions are sort of $$.

Good luck!
 
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