GoatAutomotive
Autocross Champion
- Location
- Georgetown, TX
- Car(s)
- 2017 VW GTI SE, DSG
This discussion is primarily for the FRONT brake pads on Golf R and PP-brake equipped vehicles.
39k miles on the car. Still well over 50% front pad life remaining. But I am DONE with the OE pad formula, chiefly for wheel dust.
(I also may be the only person who doesn't find the OE pads to be grabby, as others have described.)
I'm ready to purchase a good (to very good) set of front pads for my daily-driven GTI, for normal to high speed street use, for as close to $100 as possible.
If it's even possible, I want something with more "bite" after 15-20% brake pedal input, and a lot less dust in normal driving.
If I pay more than $100 for the front set of pads, they need to offer a noticeable improvement in stopping performance with low-dust attributes.
That's the elasticity of cost we're working with. $100 pad budget. $150 is the ceiling. This rules out i-Sweep 2000 and above; Endless, Carbotech, and other expensive choices costing $200-350 for one axle set.
Topics covered below: Ceramics, aftermarket options, and the dreaded brake pad clunk that is unique to the Golf R caliper brackets.
I need input from folks who have walked this road and found satisfaction from their pad choice, because I'm not finding a definitive answer.
...After ~9-10hrs (over the last week or so) of reading through reviews on Google, ECS, TireRack, here, and other car forums for BMW, Corvette, etc. The search for good pads on a medium budget has become a loop.
I suspect part of this is because brakes, like tires and suspension ride quality, are highly subjective for the driver.
Folks can have very different driving styles, and varied thresholds for what type of noise from their brakes is acceptable.
CERAMICS
With most ceramic pad formulations reviewed, folks loved their silence and low-dust experiences, at the expense of dull or reduced friction and [what some refer to as] "bite". Semi-metallic formulations will generally offer more bite and heat tolerance than a ceramic. We know and accept this.
Some folks liked the feel and grab of the ceramic pads, found it comparable to stock and overall satisfactory, but they had the dreaded clunking issues described a little further down in this post.
***NOTE: I am open to a ceramic pad if I can find a formulation that is kind to the rotors, and offers a good friction coefficient from ambient to ~500* (aka "bite" and grab as felt through the pedal when applying it)
The dreaded PP aftermarket brake pad clunk...
Every time I THINK I found the pads I'll be purchasing, I read about fitment issues with the tabs, and the clunking noises that ensue from poorly machined/manufactured aftermarket backing plates and hardware. Folks running standard GTI brakes likely haven't experienced this, so it may be lesser known, and isolated to the Golf R caliper brackets.
Out of experimental desperation, I was willing to try the same budget-friendly Duralast DGs (made by Bosch) that I've used on customer cars with good results; Part# DG1633.
Quick search on the DGs: bad reviews abound across the board on those from folks who had the dreaded loose-fitment/clunking issue.
So I'm starting a poll. Hopefully this thread can stay positive and collaborative, and help anyone in similar circumstances to me avoid having to spend countless hours getting lost down the rabbit hole of "the Research Loop."
Good replacement street pads on a car need to meet or slightly surpass stock brake performance (so far as stopping power on the street) with minimal brake dust and noise in normal operating conditions (can't speak for sub-freezing temps...I'm in central TX).
I'm not expecting miracles. Just something that doesn't produce buyer's remorse and coat my beautiful wheels with soot like a kid in a 19th-century coal mine.
<---Wheels with stockVW/Audi/BMW brake pads inside...
Top candidates thus far:
...i-Sweep 1500 and Hawk HPS 5.0 are on the upper end of the budget, with mostly positive reviews. $138 and $122, respectively.
...VERY little first-hand info available from users on the i-Sweep 2000s, which are ~$194.
i-Sweep's data charts make the 2000s look very promising, but how is their dust level in normal driving conditions?
...Brembo and Centric PosiQuiet have some options that have received mixed reviews (some excellent, some dreadful or just disappointing).
See their pads and pricing here: Brembo, Akebono, Centric pads on TireRack.com
Lots of folks reviewing the Centric PQs fail to list if they are using the Semi-Metallic or Ceramic formulation. Centric offers both within a few dollars of one another.
Brembo accordingly has their Ceramic, NAO Ceramic, and Low Metallic formulas, just to add to consumer confusion and analysis paralysis.
...Mixed reviews on Porterfield R4S, which I used as a street pad on my much heavier 640hp GTO (3450-3500lbs w/o driver, lots of weight reduction). Some loved them and said they were low dust. Others said average dust and soft brake pedal (like an average ceramic or NAO pad)
...Stop Tech Street Performance pads received mostly good reviews, offering improved pad bite. Some said dust matched stock. Some said it was even worse. No clue what to think here without talking to current users.
...Hawk HPS have been good to many users, but are also known to be harder on rotors due to their semi-metallic formulation, and after so many months or miles (even when textbook install & break-in procedures are employed)...the Hawk HPS will produce unwanted squeals and increased brake dust. This is speaking from dozens of online reviews, and person experience using them on my GTO many years ago as a street pad.
...As of ~2018, the Hawk HPS 5.0 is touted to offer comparable grab to the HPS, possibly with less noise and a more rotor friendly formulation?
I'd love to hear from anyone here using HPS 5.0 pads on the street and for spirited canyon runs around mountains.
...And lastly in this compilation - TRW offered a 1633C ceramic pad for the Golf R calipers with outstanding customer reviews.
I would buy these right now if I could! These were affordable (under $70) and received universal praise from folks who reviewed them, for matching stock brake pad friction with none of the dust production of OE euro pads.
But like your favorite TV shows, they were discontinued unexpectedly a while back, to great disappointment of the folks who knew about them. Illustrations below. Pour out a little liquor...
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
...So now you see...I'm back in the the Research Loop.
Anyway...this is a long-winded but necessary start. We need a consolidated thread where people can speak freely about their street/mild performance pad experiences.
Fire up the polls!
(And let's hope Twatter and FakeBook don't compromise this electoral process)
Start your street pad reviews...GO!
39k miles on the car. Still well over 50% front pad life remaining. But I am DONE with the OE pad formula, chiefly for wheel dust.
(I also may be the only person who doesn't find the OE pads to be grabby, as others have described.)
I'm ready to purchase a good (to very good) set of front pads for my daily-driven GTI, for normal to high speed street use, for as close to $100 as possible.
If it's even possible, I want something with more "bite" after 15-20% brake pedal input, and a lot less dust in normal driving.
If I pay more than $100 for the front set of pads, they need to offer a noticeable improvement in stopping performance with low-dust attributes.
That's the elasticity of cost we're working with. $100 pad budget. $150 is the ceiling. This rules out i-Sweep 2000 and above; Endless, Carbotech, and other expensive choices costing $200-350 for one axle set.
Topics covered below: Ceramics, aftermarket options, and the dreaded brake pad clunk that is unique to the Golf R caliper brackets.
I need input from folks who have walked this road and found satisfaction from their pad choice, because I'm not finding a definitive answer.
...After ~9-10hrs (over the last week or so) of reading through reviews on Google, ECS, TireRack, here, and other car forums for BMW, Corvette, etc. The search for good pads on a medium budget has become a loop.
I suspect part of this is because brakes, like tires and suspension ride quality, are highly subjective for the driver.
Folks can have very different driving styles, and varied thresholds for what type of noise from their brakes is acceptable.
CERAMICS
With most ceramic pad formulations reviewed, folks loved their silence and low-dust experiences, at the expense of dull or reduced friction and [what some refer to as] "bite". Semi-metallic formulations will generally offer more bite and heat tolerance than a ceramic. We know and accept this.
Some folks liked the feel and grab of the ceramic pads, found it comparable to stock and overall satisfactory, but they had the dreaded clunking issues described a little further down in this post.
***NOTE: I am open to a ceramic pad if I can find a formulation that is kind to the rotors, and offers a good friction coefficient from ambient to ~500* (aka "bite" and grab as felt through the pedal when applying it)
The dreaded PP aftermarket brake pad clunk...
Every time I THINK I found the pads I'll be purchasing, I read about fitment issues with the tabs, and the clunking noises that ensue from poorly machined/manufactured aftermarket backing plates and hardware. Folks running standard GTI brakes likely haven't experienced this, so it may be lesser known, and isolated to the Golf R caliper brackets.
Out of experimental desperation, I was willing to try the same budget-friendly Duralast DGs (made by Bosch) that I've used on customer cars with good results; Part# DG1633.
Quick search on the DGs: bad reviews abound across the board on those from folks who had the dreaded loose-fitment/clunking issue.
So I'm starting a poll. Hopefully this thread can stay positive and collaborative, and help anyone in similar circumstances to me avoid having to spend countless hours getting lost down the rabbit hole of "the Research Loop."
Good replacement street pads on a car need to meet or slightly surpass stock brake performance (so far as stopping power on the street) with minimal brake dust and noise in normal operating conditions (can't speak for sub-freezing temps...I'm in central TX).
I'm not expecting miracles. Just something that doesn't produce buyer's remorse and coat my beautiful wheels with soot like a kid in a 19th-century coal mine.
Top candidates thus far:
...i-Sweep 1500 and Hawk HPS 5.0 are on the upper end of the budget, with mostly positive reviews. $138 and $122, respectively.
...VERY little first-hand info available from users on the i-Sweep 2000s, which are ~$194.
i-Sweep's data charts make the 2000s look very promising, but how is their dust level in normal driving conditions?
...Brembo and Centric PosiQuiet have some options that have received mixed reviews (some excellent, some dreadful or just disappointing).
See their pads and pricing here: Brembo, Akebono, Centric pads on TireRack.com
Lots of folks reviewing the Centric PQs fail to list if they are using the Semi-Metallic or Ceramic formulation. Centric offers both within a few dollars of one another.
Brembo accordingly has their Ceramic, NAO Ceramic, and Low Metallic formulas, just to add to consumer confusion and analysis paralysis.
...Mixed reviews on Porterfield R4S, which I used as a street pad on my much heavier 640hp GTO (3450-3500lbs w/o driver, lots of weight reduction). Some loved them and said they were low dust. Others said average dust and soft brake pedal (like an average ceramic or NAO pad)
...Stop Tech Street Performance pads received mostly good reviews, offering improved pad bite. Some said dust matched stock. Some said it was even worse. No clue what to think here without talking to current users.
...Hawk HPS have been good to many users, but are also known to be harder on rotors due to their semi-metallic formulation, and after so many months or miles (even when textbook install & break-in procedures are employed)...the Hawk HPS will produce unwanted squeals and increased brake dust. This is speaking from dozens of online reviews, and person experience using them on my GTO many years ago as a street pad.
...As of ~2018, the Hawk HPS 5.0 is touted to offer comparable grab to the HPS, possibly with less noise and a more rotor friendly formulation?
I'd love to hear from anyone here using HPS 5.0 pads on the street and for spirited canyon runs around mountains.
...And lastly in this compilation - TRW offered a 1633C ceramic pad for the Golf R calipers with outstanding customer reviews.
I would buy these right now if I could! These were affordable (under $70) and received universal praise from folks who reviewed them, for matching stock brake pad friction with none of the dust production of OE euro pads.
But like your favorite TV shows, they were discontinued unexpectedly a while back, to great disappointment of the folks who knew about them. Illustrations below. Pour out a little liquor...
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
...So now you see...I'm back in the the Research Loop.
Anyway...this is a long-winded but necessary start. We need a consolidated thread where people can speak freely about their street/mild performance pad experiences.
Fire up the polls!
(And let's hope Twatter and FakeBook don't compromise this electoral process)
Start your street pad reviews...GO!