jimlloyd40
Autocross Champion
- Location
- Phoenix
- Car(s)
- 2018 SE DSG
and neither are you.
I wasn't the one who said that you aren't a lawyer.
and neither are you.
As-is is a great point, and I agree to an extent. But, when you bring residual transferable warranty into play, which the OP is doing, things change; reread the original post.
The OP is deliberately returning to stock, a modification that had knowingly voided/will void the residual warranty, to facilitate making more money in the trade in.
He is knowingly omitting otherwise pertinent and impactful information in order to facilitate financial gain. As such, he clearly meets the definition of fraud by omission.
I read the original post. Read my first post, I sold a previously tuned car to a vw dealer outright earlier this year. The only guarantee I gave them in any paperwork I signed was that the odometer wasn’t rolled back. They had the ability to check the flash counter themselves and didn’t, their problem not mine, no different than not opening the hood to see a cold air intake or missing a giant crack in the windshield. They haven’t come for me yet and I know the guy who bought it let them know it was previously modified.
The only time you’re really going to have a duty to disclose is if there is a real safety issue you are aware of, ie the brakes don’t work below 50 degrees, the airbags aren’t functional etc.
If I sold it private party and advertised that it still had the remaining warranty, yes that would be a problem.
If the buyer knew that it had been tuned then you're off the hook. Unless the buyer denies knowing it had been tuned if warranty work is needed. Then it could be a he said he said issue.
I'm off the hook. He didn't buy the car from me. I sold it to a vw dealer. They certified a car they shouldn't have, sold it to the new owner and that is their problem, not mine.
When I traded in my Honda Accord recently the dealer had me sign paperwork regarding it's "expected remaining warranty." If you have a modded R, that should be under warranty, I assume disclosing the tune would greatly impact the dealers trade in value. I'm wondering if people are just flashing back to stock and not disclosing the tune (which is what I would likely do), but I wonder if the dealer would eventually come back and say you failed to disclose the TD1 flag.
Not a trade in but I sold my R outright to a vw dealer earlier this year. Former big turbo car that was returned to stock minus the clutch/short shifter. They didn't ask, I didn't volunteer it, and then they certified the car. New owner found me, I apparently left a couple business cards in the glovebox, and was less than pleased.
I read the original post. Read my first post, I sold a previously tuned car to a vw dealer outright earlier this year. The only guarantee I gave them in any paperwork I signed was that the odometer wasn’t rolled back. They had the ability to check the flash counter themselves and didn’t, their problem not mine, no different than not opening the hood to see a cold air intake or missing a giant crack in the windshield. They haven’t come for me yet and I know the guy who bought it let them know it was previously modified.
The only time you’re really going to have a duty to disclose is if there is a real safety issue you are aware of, ie the brakes don’t work below 50 degrees, the airbags aren’t functional etc.
If I sold it private party and advertised that it still had the remaining warranty, yes that would be a problem.
Yo, what (some of) y'all are continually missing is something called Caveat Emptor.
If the dealer buys a car from you, asks you 0 questions, only asks you to sign title transfer, you have 0 obligation beyond that.
Even if you have sold them a car in need of new tires and brake pads. Even if it's tuned and TD1'd. After they take possession of it those all become the dealers problem since it was on -the dealer- to do due diligence at the time of purchase.
Fraud by omission requires that you've actually omitted something you were asked specifically about. If you aren't asked you are under no lawful obligation to disclose anything about the car.
Also, these are near impossible scenarios, we're not talking about selling a used Ferrari here. Unless you private sale the car and specifically lie about the Warranty balance or falsified maintenance records there is 0 chance of any blowback on the seller.
Fraud by omission requires that you've actually omitted something you were asked specifically about. If you aren't asked you are under no lawful obligation to disclose anything about the car.
His question is; if he omits notification to the buyer/dealership that modifications, known to him to void the residual transferable warranty, have been done to gain a higher trade in value, is he liable.
Simple answer, yes. It is textbook fraud by omission. Maybe this is a good time to google that phrase?
You sold a 2016 with ~35,xxx miles (per your for sale thread). As this is before the “People First” warranty, the residual of your 5yr/60k powertrain was voided along with any remaining 3yr/36k bumper to bumper. So continued warranty was of no concern at the time of your sale.
They then certified the car and sold it as such with a CPO warranty. New owner was caught with his pants down when he found out his warranty was voided because of your prior actions. Had he, or the dealership, wanted to seek retribution, you are/were liable for damages under the same fraud by omission. You, with intent to defraud, did not disclose the car had been modified in a manner to negate any/all warranties offered by VW on the vehicle, and returned the vehicle to stock to conceal your actions. Whether you did so because they didn’t ask and/or you didn’t offer, or not, is immaterial. You knowingly didn’t disclose information, known to you at the time to affect the possible resale value and VW warranty, to facilitate an increase in the vehicle’s trade value. This is, as is the hypothetical situation poised by the OP, textbook fraud by omission. The difference is, he has hypothetical residual warranty concerns, and you actually did commit fraud.
I am not saying anyone is going after you, in your specific situation. The OP is asking, hypothetically, could he be liable for damages if he commits this type of fraud, and the answer is a resounding, yes.
I understand that you think what you did is okay and fully legal, a common issue in our culture, but the fact remains; fraud by omission is illegal. If action, intent, causation, and victimization can be established, such as detailing and defending one’s actions on social media, then the case against you is easily made. Sorry.
I would also suggest you refrain from providing legal advice in matters you clearly do not understand.
TLDR:
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You really are that dense. Well, best of luck to you in all your endeavors.
and in the case of the ECU not easily identified
Damn man. You truly are dumb.
Thought you were done here but I see you aren’t a man of your word. Go on... and try not to make light of mental illness moving forward.
I apologize, had I known you had a mental illness, and not just simply an idiot, I may have not engaged in this discussion with you.