Free MT6 wonder mod: OEM bleeder delay removal

[TrinivdubOG]

It was also discussed in another thread on the 1st page.

http://www.golfmk7.com/forums/showthread.php?t=37719

See image below, from the delay valve the clutch line runs straight into it.

 

[burchtd]

Necromancy at its finest.

My apologies for resurrecting this thread yet again; I read through the pages and I wanted to ask a few questions to make sure I understand this correctly.

So if I do the OEM route, the swirl ring doesn’t need to be removed? I interpreted the first few pages as ‘remove the diphrgram (sp?) and re install the part and you’re golden. With the ECS you do need to locate that, because the extra ring still doesn’t play nice with the new part?

Also I was looking at this mod and cross searched a 034 Mount/HPA dogbone insert suggestion from another thread. I had assumed this would take care of most of the added stress from removing the yellow piece (cause I definitely can’t spell that right, lol) plus I am interested in the benefits, but want to avoid excessive NVH. But anyway my question is: as LeGti commented, after that’s done addressing shift cables and other modifications would ultimately help and really bring the transmission alive? What about a drivetrain mod? Is that really necessary? As far as my driving style goes, I really don’t push the car, I shift around 3,000 RPM’s. Albeit, my 1-2 shifts aren’t the best (sometimes jerky but I contribute that to the delay. I have gotten some really good ones but it’s when I stay on the clutch until the RPM’s drop to about...1.5 or so? You tuber ‘Paynos’ described it as waiting until the car enters the ‘gate’ after shifting and pulling off the clutch just right to prevent sudden lurching) this is my first manual car, so I’ve been reading researching and watching a lot of YouTube to get the best practices and try implementing them on the daily.

Thanks ahead of time for your response!

EDIT: ‘swirly ring’ is the piece that TrinivdubOG is pointing at in his picture above my post.

 

[dman918]

OK, I seemed to have lost one of the O-rings. Does anyone know the size O-ring that is needed to replace?

 

[bigdave79]

OK, I seemed to have lost one of the O-rings. Does anyone know the size O-ring that is needed to replace?

I think I have a couple of them lying around from my ecs bleeder block. PM me and I can probably mail one to you.

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[dman918]

I think I have a couple of them lying around from my ecs bleeder block. PM me and I can probably mail one to you.

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I really appreciate that, but the car is apart so I need to run to Home Depot and get it up and running right away. Thanks so much for the kind gesture though.

 

[Slack]

So I finally got around to doing the Clutch Delay Valve Removal last weekend. Thanks to all of the various DIY’s and discussion around this topic, I thought I could get out of this job clean and enjoy proper clutch engagement in an hour or so. Not so fast, my friends. When I removed the bleeder crew assembly, I discovered some whitish-grayish, slightly gritty residue inside the top of the plastic tee. Not cool. I wiped, washed, and dried it, naively thinking this wasn’t too far out of the ordinary. Just a little residue. Probably all the chirping gears and pulling Brodie’s I do. I reinstalled all the parts and hooked up a mityvac to bleed. Lots of air and a bit of fluid. I took the bleeder block on and off a couple of times to try to see if i put it on wrong. I hadn’t. The clips all installed smoothly and the bleeder nipple assembly was flush like in the pics, but it had some play in it. Kind of rocked a bit front and back when I wiggled it. Trip to the auto parts store and a new o-ring. It looked good but maybe it was degrading and the cause of the residue and the play. Dude behind the counter helped me find something that looked really close to the right size. Still wiggled, but I started to think maybe static pressure in the line is what holds it in place. Re-install and and drug the wife out in the garage to try a traditional bleed. I still had a vinyl hose attached to observe bubbles. This is what came out. Chunks of white stuff. Milky brake fluid. I sucked it into a catch can to keep. I ordered the ECS bleeder block and the exact-fit braided hose. All-metal parts seemed like a good idea, and as long as I’m going to be bleeding the hell out of it why not do the line too? Throw in an adjustable clutch stop please, ECS Tuning, but don’t tell the wife about that one. Parts came today, installing soon. I guess the thing I’m most worried about is getting all the gunk out. Any ideas about what that stuff might be? Where it came from? Why it’s there? How much fluid is still in the slave cylinder side? If I run a couple of liters of DOT 4 through am I apt to get it all out? I talked to a VW tech who thought that this might be my best option. Warranty considerations? Fire away and thanks for your consideration.

Posted in oils and maintenance, but thought I might ask here too.

 

[bigdave79]

Whoa that's messed up. Could anything have gotten into your brake fluid reservoir? Something in there could have gotten sucked down into your clutch line. Have you tried bleeding the brakes to see if the same stuff comes out?

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[Slack]

I hear what you are saying bigdave. This is the first time I've cracked the cap on the reservoir. Fluid appears to be clear up top, but anything is possible I guess. I've taken a look at doing more extensive flush. I think a couple pages back somebody described a reverse bleed that seemed to work in a circular fashion. I am hoping to keep it isolated to the clutch line right now as I suspect the block was leaking at the factory or dealer and somebody used the bleeder to inject some kind of stop leak. I bought the car with under 50 miles. I’ve also read that some manufacturers use a silicon based lube during assembly. Maybe that’s the culprit.

 

[TagGTI]

Bought the ECS bleeder block but everything considered it was a waste of money. The valve stem thing wasn't seated properly so even at close, fluid still leaked through on top of the clips not being able holding it down properly. Ended up having to use the stock clips and stock valve stem for it to work.

 

[honestabe1]

I hear what you are saying bigdave. This is the first time I've cracked the cap on the reservoir. Fluid appears to be clear up top, but anything is possible I guess. I've taken a look at doing more extensive flush. I think a couple pages back somebody described a reverse bleed that seemed to work in a circular fashion. I am hoping to keep it isolated to the clutch line right now as I suspect the block was leaking at the factory or dealer and somebody used the bleeder to inject some kind of stop leak. I bought the car with under 50 miles. I’ve also read that some manufacturers use a silicon based lube during assembly. Maybe that’s the culprit.

Probably a sealant of some kind, first thing I thought of was PTFE thread sealing tape, although very unlikely VW uses tape from the factory, pipe/tubing fittings generally do require sealant. A flush sounds like a good idea just to be safe.

 

[CarolinaPanthers]

I've been lurking around for a while here and rarely post but felt the need to post lol. Just did this, clutch spring removal, and snow grate removal and I am very happy with the changes!

Full disclosure: My experience with manual transmissions is relegated to 3 three years in a 2015 Golf S 5mt, left bone stock. And about 8 months in my current GTI S 6mt. And of course the placebo effect can be very real.

I removed the clutch spring about 6 months ago after owning the car for a few months. It was a pleasant upgrade, but not mind blowing. Yesterday I removed the snow grate and CDV and I am very happy with the change in the the clutch pedal. The clutch pedal returns faster, possibly the slightest bit heavier, and with a bit more of a pronounced engagement point. It is nice being able to feel a consistent engagement point haha. Downshifting and rev matching on the highway feels much better as well. It feels like less of a waiting game for the clutch to get out of it's own way. I also feel that I can shift more quickly and smoothly. Pretty stoked!

Not sure what, if any, the clutch mods vs. snow grate removal have any effect on this, but the car seems to pull a little better and rev a little freer.

For $20 of a container of much more DOT 4 fluid than you'll need and about of hour of time and effort, you can't go wrong with these simple and free/cheap mods. Just buy the smaller size of DOT 4 lol!

 

[rallymaniac555]

So I stopped reading around May 2016 and I must say that the methods for bleeding the clutch line described there-in is tedious and more involving.

I'll share my method of bleeding any clutch on any car and it's as simple as a length of clear hose and two zip ties.

Start by removing the wheel closest to the clutch slave and cracking the bleed valve on the brake caliper.

Remove the fluid reservoir cap and attach the clear tubing to the valve, securing it with a zip tie.

Prime the tubing by pumping your brake pedal a few times until the air is displaced. You can then crack the valve on the clutch slave or bleed block and attach the primed tubing and secure with a zip tie.

Top off the fluid reservoir and return to the cabin. By pumping the brake pedal nice and slow about 15-20 times, this closed loop, reverse bleeding, is sure to force any air trapped in the system into the reservoir where it can escape into the atmosphere.

Making sure to avoid the clutch pedal until the valves are closed will make the job simple and headache free. Remember brake fluid is corrosive and will destroy most things unless cleaned ASAP.

Good luck and happy modding!!


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I may have to try this. Sounds like it's easy to do by yourself. One question, when you are priming the line from the brake caliper, do you just leave the bleeder screw on the caliper partially open between pedal pumps? Doesn't this suck air into the caliper?

 

[Gr33nBunny]

I may have to try this. Sounds like it's easy to do by yourself. One question, when you are priming the line from the brake caliper, do you just leave the bleeder screw on the caliper partially open between pedal pumps? Doesn't this suck air into the caliper?

Not OP, but no. The fluid is forced out of the valve into the line, and any vacuum is going to suck fluid into the system instead of air. It's similar to bleeding the system with a jar and primed hose

 

[rallymaniac555]

Not OP, but no. The fluid is forced out of the valve into the line, and any vacuum is going to suck fluid into the system instead of air. It's similar to bleeding the system with a jar and primed hose

Thanks for the input. I tried something different since I wasn't entirely sure about the brake "assist" method. I just bought about 5ft of a clear tube and after I removed the bleeder restrictor and re-assembled the hydraulic line I just simply attached the clear tube to the bleeder valve, opened the valve a bit and gently sucked on the other end of the clear tube so that the fluid maybe came up 5-6 inches into the tube. By holding holding the suction I was able to see the bubbles make their way through the fluid in the clear tube and I stopped my sucking once the bubbles were not coming out but more clear fluid continued to come out when I continued sucking. At that point, I just closed the bleeder valve and removed the tube with a bit of fluid in it and I was done. I didn't touch the clutch pedal in any of this process until I was completely done. I pumped it up a few times and the feel was immediately exactly the same as it was before I even started. Started the car and everything worked great.
The mod, while improves the speed to clutch grab, doesn't really change the clutch feel for me much. Maybe it's the dual mass flywheel but I still feel like the clutch engagement point is all over the pedal travel and it's not consistent. Maybe the rev hang has something to do with it as the 1-2nd sifts are still the worst and it feels like the pedal grabs much higher then it does when i'm just starting from the dead stop in 1st. I removed the pedal spring as well but other than the pedal being a bit stiffer, not much has changed.

 

[uberdot]

Did this today. That little yellow diaphragm thing was really seated there. Couldn’t get it out without really tearing the thing up and marring the inside of the valve up along with it. Anyone else have this issue?

Also one of those clips was crumbled upon removal and is pretty much vaporized. Are those at all standard or is it VW proprietary?