Engine Oil Grade, recommendations.

[scrllock]

Except in my experience each of the 4 MK7s we’ve owned burned that M1 0w40 while I haven’t experienced that with LM or AMS 5w40 at all. My 2017 sport ran M1 for ~27k of its 37k miles before losing an engine.

Just my empirical opinion but I won’t run it anymore, certs or not and I’m fairly certain you’ve seen me post the M1 rebate threads up when it would happen back in 2016-2019. I ran the shit out of that stuff in a lot of cars.

Stick to 5k changes using LMs excellent oil and am also using a fuel additive by Driven racing oils to help with uncontrolled ethanol amounts permitted by the govt in both summer and winter months.

This was an interesting, data and real world experience driven, watch.

LM is *okay*. Despite the name, no molybdenum unless you run their additives, which drive the price up. M1 0w40/5w40 still has some moly, and still contains more ZDDP too.
That said, I'm biased too, having blown up a motor on LM (which it was on the entire time I owned it).

A 0W40 will also be appropriate (502 00) even if you are in a warm climate. Keep in mind they use M1 0W40 in Porsche race cars. Both are 40w oils.

IMO 0w40 is perfectly fine, but the porsche/corvette "race car oil" thing always strikes me as a weird justification. Most of those are aluminum, running larger clearances than our iron-block economy motors. Just because it's factory fill for an entirely unrelated motor doesn't mean it's the ideal choice.
If anything, conventional engine-building rules would say the stock clearances on our motors (.015" or less) require a 5w20/5w30, but everyone tuning them suggests a lot more HTST (5w40). Obviously VW has decided that anything in the 502 standard is cool for warranty, so it's mostly moot. But I am really curious if people go a bit overboard on viscosity.

 

[tigeo]

LM is *okay*. Despite the name, no molybdenum unless you run their additives, which drive the price up. M1 0w40/5w40 still has some moly, and still contains more ZDDP too.
That said, I'm biased too, having blown up a motor on LM (which it was on the entire time I owned it).



IMO 0w40 is perfectly fine, but the porsche/corvette "race car oil" thing always strikes me as a weird justification. Most of those are aluminum, running larger clearances than our iron-block economy motors. Just because it's factory fill for an entirely unrelated motor doesn't mean it's the ideal choice.
If anything, conventional engine-building rules would say the stock clearances on our motors (.015" or less) require a 5w20/5w30, but everyone tuning them suggests a lot more HTST (5w40). Obviously VW has decided that anything in the 502 standard is cool for warranty, so it's mostly moot. But I am really curious if people go a bit overboard on viscosity.

The justification is simply for the folks that think zero winter rating = "like water bro" which I read all the time and 0W40s in higher power applications should show that it's not an issue. 0W40 and 5W40 have the same HTHS with the 0W having a bit higher quality base stock to get that spread in viscosity but they are using more VIIs to get it. I agree that folks go overboard on viscosity without a solid understanding of how this all works. There are a few 0W30 oils that have the VW502 00 approval and 502 says HTHS great than or equal to 3.5 so in reality, that 30W is protecting about the same as the 40W...plus most of the Euro 40s are light 40s and shear down to a 30W almost immediately with the fuel dilution we get. The euro 30s are heavy 30s so really not much of a difference but more viscosity means more MOFT and that's what really drives it I think...MOFT kind of wins here but also of note, many people just driving around daily-use on the street think they are really hammering their cars when they aren't. VW504 oils are all 30W and very stout oils that any of us can run as they are backwards compatible to VW502.

 

[scrllock]

0W40 and 5W40 have the same HTHS with the 0W having a bit higher quality base stock to get that spread in viscosity but they are using more VIIs to get it.

agree with everything else, but 5w40s should have slightly higher HTST than 0w40, at least comparing euro formulas from the same brand. e.g. M1 is 3.8 vs 3.6, and all of the super high options (4.0+) are 5w40.

 

[Nineeightyone]

So for people who aren't quite so oil-intelligent... What's with the 508 spec? Currently running LM Top-Tec 0w20 in my 2019 because that's what the manual says, changes every 5k like clockwork. I generally see oil temps up to 220F but not higher, at least reported in the cluster. No track days, occasional pulls on the freeway but nothing too absurd.

Am I worrying about nothing, or should I move to a heavier weight oil? I've been sticking with LM because it's the only 508 spec I found, but I'm curious if maybe 5w30 would be a smarter move.

 

[R0dzilla7]

I have a 2019 and I’ve run 5w-40 since new. The dealership changed the oil twice and I’ve changed it twice. It states in the manual that you can still run 5w-40 but MPGs will suffer. Just change it regularly with oil that meets spec and life will be good.

 

[scrllock]

So for people who aren't quite so oil-intelligent... What's with the 508 spec? Currently running LM Top-Tec 0w20 in my 2019 because that's what the manual says, changes every 5k like clockwork. I generally see oil temps up to 220F but not higher, at least reported in the cluster. No track days, occasional pulls on the freeway but nothing too absurd.

Am I worrying about nothing, or should I move to a heavier weight oil? I've been sticking with LM because it's the only 508 spec I found, but I'm curious if maybe 5w30 would be a smarter move.

afaik the only difference with the 2019+ GTI was the number of teeth on the oil pump gear. bearing/crank clearances weren't changed, so the old oils aren't going to blow it up or anything.

 

[ReadTheBook]

LM is *okay*. Despite the name, no molybdenum unless you run their additives, which drive the price up. M1 0w40/5w40 still has some moly, and still contains more ZDDP too.
That said, I'm biased too, having blown up a motor on LM (which it was on the entire time I owned it).

Interesting. Was that on a daily? Did it consume any oil? That was a big factor for me. ALWAYS 1 or more L consumed with M1 for some reason. LM I don’t consume anything noticeable.

I know there’s no Moly.

 

[Nineeightyone]

Is there any concern about the approval, i.e. 508 00 vs 502 00/504 00? Again I'm probably overthinking it, as I've not had any issues with the 0w20 in my GTI, so maybe I'm worrying a little about nothing. Next 5000 miles is going to be on 0w20 LM Top Tec (becasue it's what I've got on hand), but I'm open to other suggestions.

 

[scrllock]

Interesting. Was that on a daily? Did it consume any oil? That was a big factor for me. ALWAYS 1 or more L consumed with M1 for some reason. LM I don’t consume anything noticeable.

I know there’s no Moly.

Not a daily driver really. Definitely consumed LM. But that's not surprising, their noack (evaporation loss) is at upper the limit allowed by VW iirc. Other oils will perform much better in terms of simple evaporation.

 

[coniglio rampante]

So for people who aren't quite so oil-intelligent... What's with the 508 spec? Currently running LM Top-Tec 0w20 in my 2019 because that's what the manual says, changes every 5k like clockwork. I generally see oil temps up to 220F but not higher, at least reported in the cluster. No track days, occasional pulls on the freeway but nothing too absurd.

Am I worrying about nothing, or should I move to a heavier weight oil? I've been sticking with LM because it's the only 508 spec I found, but I'm curious if maybe 5w30 would be a smarter move.

IMO, yes, re: “worrying about nothing.” What you describe is normal street use/temps and the VW engineers certainly considered the specified oil grade for normal use.

 

[YamR1rider]

I'm largely of the mindset that any 502 will be fine in my '15 and '17 cars and the cheapest I found (certainly back in the M1 rebate days), was 0W40 M1 Euro. Even now they seem to have stopped the rebates, it still seems to be the cheapest round here, so that's what I've always used. Never had any burning issues to speak of between 5k changes.