GOLFMK8
GOLFMK7
GOLFMK6
GOLFMKV

Do you do your first oil change early?

LGriff86

Passed Driver's Ed
Location
KCLE
Car(s)
Urano 6MT Rabbit
change oil after break-in

close thread
Thats what I did but the manual for our cars doesn't support that opinion unfortunately. Is there stance of 10,000mi intervals driven by ecological concerns(EPA) or R&D results? Thats why this thread exists. The manual is in direct conflict with "traditional" rules of thumb. I've spoken with engineers at companies supplying motorsports and automotive industry(NASCAR etc., OEMs, Autozone and O'reilly's) when I was debating switching oil and grade from Castrol 0W-20, or deviating from manufacturers oil change interval. They conveyed to me a tremendous amount of effort and money goes into selecting oil type and grade and their recommendations for change intervals. Again, I changed mine after break in, will run reduced change intervals and am likely to switch to a different brand and weight. Why I think I know better than the engineers at VAG, I have no idea.
 

tigeo

Autocross Champion
Thats what I did but the manual for our cars doesn't support that opinion unfortunately. Is there stance of 10,000mi intervals driven by ecological concerns(EPA) or R&D results? Thats why this thread exists. The manual is in direct conflict with "traditional" rules of thumb. I've spoken with engineers at companies supplying motorsports and automotive industry(NASCAR etc., OEMs, Autozone and O'reilly's) when I was debating switching oil and grade from Castrol 0W-20, or deviating from manufacturers oil change interval. They conveyed to me a tremendous amount of effort and money goes into selecting oil type and grade and their recommendations for change intervals. Again, I changed mine after break in, will run reduced change intervals and am likely to switch to a different brand and weight. Why I think I know better than the engineers at VAG, I have no idea.
It's driven by repeated data that support that for "normal" driving by "normal" people, the oil with the appropriate approvals has sufficient additive and viscosity to go 10K miles without causing excessive wear etc. That's really it. If you believe the data, great. If not, ok? Folks are so hung up on this and the old-school notion of 3K mile oil change mantra that they can't ever get past it is my take. Look at my 9K oil change interval...that included drag racing at a local track and hammering my car with launches, >100mph highway runs, etc. It looks fine. I can guarantee the engine will fail at some point but not b/c of my oil change interval choice. I always laugh when folks post up UOAs with ~3K miles on it and say "Wow...look at how good it looks!" b/c...of course it looks good...any modern oil will look good at such a low mileage.
 
Last edited:

Shane_Anigans

Drag Race Newbie
Location
SE MI
Car(s)
2017 GTI Sport DSG
It's driven by repeated data that support that for "normal" driving by "normal" people, the oil with the appropriate approvals has sufficient additive and viscosity to go 10K miles without causing excessive wear etc. That's really it. If you believe the data, great. If not, ok? Folks are so hung up on this and the old-school notion of 3K mile oil change mantra that they can't ever get past it is my take. Look at my 9K oil change interval...that included drag racing at a local track and hammering my car with launches, >100mnph highway runs, etc. It looks fine. I can guarantee the engine will fail at some point but not b/c of my oil change interval choice. I always laugh when folks post up UOAs with ~3K miles on it and say "Wow...look at how good it looks!" b/c...of course it looks good...any modern oil will look good at such a low mileage.

Normal driving: I used to work at the proving grounds of a giant multinational automaker, where we tested product durability. Anyone who thinks that their personal driving style comes anywhere close to the sort of testing we would put vehicles through is kidding themselves. Cars are subjected to levels of abuse that rental cars won't undergo, and the maintenance schedules could best be described as "negligent." BTW, I'm not even talking about vehicles which anyone would consider particularly high in quality, either.

3K Oil Change: It's because that's what dad and grandad always told you, even though they probably knew dick-all about cars. Once upon a time, a company that made motor oil came up with this standard, and it's been like religious dogma ever since. Even if it were remotely based in fact, every aspect of lubrication technology has moved light years past whatever they used to establish a 3,000 mile interval, but people still adhere to it. I can't think of a single other thing from 1969 that people still do, the way they insist 3,000 mile oil changes are a still a good/necessary idea. BMW switched to synthetic long-life oil and 15K intervals 2 decades ago, and in the time I worked at the dealership, we never saw a single engine issue that could be the result of the extended drain intervals. The engines just kept on running smoothly, long after every other component on the cars had failed twice over.

Of course, having said all that, there are always exceptions, e.g. Toyota and their sludge problem.
 

tigeo

Autocross Champion
BMW switched to synthetic long-life oil and 15K intervals 2 decades ago, and in the time I worked at the dealership, we never saw a single engine issue that could be the result of the extended drain intervals. The engines just kept on running smoothly, long after every other component on the cars had failed twice over.
That's just it - high-quality/high-additive pack synthetic/blend oils. The oils back in the '60s-70s were just not up to task compared to what we have today. Also the notion of break-in oils/periods and "metal shavings" in your oil. Big difference between today's engine production and those from that that era. Sure, you get some metal wear but it's captured by the filter - that's the point of it...these bits don't just keep recirculating through your engine. Also, if the concern is that, I'd say changing the oil every few 00 miles would be needed with testing to determine when all the metals are gone and you can stop the short interval changes - otherwise, even with say a 1500 mile initial change, you still "recirculated the metal shavings" for 1500 miles so how does that work if the goal is to remove it. It's all ritualistic and not really based on anything more than folklore.
 

Shane_Anigans

Drag Race Newbie
Location
SE MI
Car(s)
2017 GTI Sport DSG
It's all ritualistic and not really based on anything more than folklore.

That describes so many things that people do, and reason why our species hasn't progressed further than it has.

Tradition is just peer pressure from dead people.
 

jimlloyd40

Autocross Champion
Location
Phoenix
Car(s)
2018 SE DSG
That describes so many things that people do, and reason why our species hasn't progressed further than it has.

Tradition is just peer pressure from dead people.

Where do you think our species should have evolved to by now? Nothing wrong with tradition at all.
 

Beju

Go Kart Newbie
Location
IL
Car(s)
2019 GTI Rabbit Ed.
I changed my 2019's oil at 4679 miles after the 1 year oil change reminder came on, and judging by the Blackstone oil analysis, I really didn't need to. Silicon and copper were higher than universal averages (probably from breaking in), but the iron level was already at the universal average, and TBN suggested that the oil had plenty of life in it. I didn't see any shiny bits in the oil or filter either.
 

LGriff86

Passed Driver's Ed
Location
KCLE
Car(s)
Urano 6MT Rabbit
I guess oil to oil change by interval I don’t care about as much. I’m betting the cumulative part per million by a fixed mileage - changing oil more often will save wear.
 
Top