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Decisions, decisions

cb1111

Newbie
Location
Virginia, USA
I realize that buying a car is a purely personal decision and outside influences shouldn’t guide my decision but I wanted your guys’ thoughts to see if I’m overlooking something.

A bit of background. I had a MkV GTI and then an R32. Loved both cars, hated the dealership. From there I moved on to a 335ix (worst car ever with the high pressure fuel pump failures that plagued most of these). I then wanted something reliable so I got an Acura TSX wagon (twice – I got a second after a Mercedes driver decided he wanted to effectively total the first) and that is what I am driving now.

The Acura is a perfectly nice car. It has sufficient power and handles quite nicely but the tech is a bit outdated and it clearly isn’t as sporting as the GTI/R. Our German Shepherd likes it as well. I suspect that I’ll talk my wife into dumping her Civic and she’ll take my Acura as it has (at 80k) half the miles of her Civic.

I’m going to give VW one last shot here in the US – but – do I get a GTI or do I get an R? While the $10k difference is quite substantial, it wouldn’t be a dealbreaker, but is the R really a better car for me?

I live (and drive) in Virginia, so stupid driving is out of the question if I want to continue driving (not that I would engage in stupid driving anyway) – but there is a possibility of some legal crazy driving with lights (no sirens) – happened on 9/11 and a couple of other times.

I tend to run winter tires and summer tires. My job does require me to be mobile in all weather conditions – even before the plows are out if need be (although that hasn’t happened in the last few years). I’ve not had issues with FWD in the last 5 years although I remember the GTI being a bit squirrely in weird weather on a standing start.

About 3 times a week I’m stuck in rush hour traffic for about an hour each way (12 miles). The other two days I’m usually visiting sites about 60 miles away – against traffic and usually departing the house at 5am and returning 6pm’ish – usually highways or multilane roads. A bit dicey in winter because one has to watch for Amish buggies going to one of the sites.

Most of the time if we go somewhere with the pooch and have somebody in the back seat, then we’ll most likely take the Acura, but the dog will see quite a bit of time in the GTI/R as I often take her along to site visits. Is there a decent dog barrier to fit behind the front seats (back seats folded) without screwing up the headliner?

With the exception of the snazzy dash, I think the GTI has the same technology as the R. It uses 87 octane gas and is $10k cheaper.

The R has better driving dynamics, smother takeoff and all weather confidence. It has that snazzy dash, a bit nicer seats but uses 91 octane.

Insurance costs are about the same when adjusted for the replacement values.

I’m kind of coming to the same conclusion as Car&Driver – the R is “better” but the GTI is the value champ.

Thoughts, opinions and comments are welcome. I’m posting this in both the GTI and R forums.
 

Dark Violet R

Ready to race!
Location
Ontario, Canada
Sounds to me .. for you, the GTI might be a better pick. It is more fuel cost economical and you save $10k. Given the type of traffic usage you experience and not really able to use the extra performance of an R; it makes more sense to buy the GTI. I have an 18 R and my son has a GTI. The GTI is a very capable car and deserves a lot of respect. Sounds to me you may be leaning in this direction too. On a final note, don't get me wrong; the R is a great car
 

drshark

Ready to race!
Really quick over-simplification to a very complex question: GTI is great value for money. A lightly nodded R is a borderline supercar. Quite different propositions, which you have to choose...
 

cb1111

Newbie
Location
Virginia, USA
Sounds to me .. for you, the GTI might be a better pick. It is more fuel cost economical and you save $10k. Given the type of traffic usage you experience and not really able to use the extra performance of an R; it makes more sense to buy the GTI. I have an 18 R and my son has a GTI. The GTI is a very capable car and deserves a lot of respect. Sounds to me you may be leaning in this direction too. On a final note, don't get me wrong; the R is a great car
It is a difficult choice - back in 2008, the r32 ran rings around the GTI but I think that has changed since then but there are still performance advantages to the AWD.

At one of my sites I have to turn left over a divided highway that gets very busy and has lousy visibility because of a hill. I was never confident turning there in the rain with the GTI but the R was quite solid. I drove a GTI in the rain a week or so ago and it didn't give me gray hair - but I had the salesman with me, so I couldn't just floor it and turn at the same time.
 

reallypeacedoff

Ready to race!
Location
Los Angeles
If I were you, I would buy the most basic GTI and not tick any boxes. That would make it exceptional value. When I was looking at the R and the GTI (Autobahn with PP etc), the real difference was around $4k and you got way more power that could translate to the road better via AWD. I drive my car like a psycho because I knew I would. The R made sense to me and super glad I convinced myself to get it. Depreciation is a lot less on an R than a fully loaded GTI BUT a "basic" GTI doesn't take as much as a hit either. Another thing to consider.
 

SD11

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Jacksonville, FL
Car(s)
2017 VW GTI SE DSG
I think the price difference is going to be a little more than 10k. I take my dog in my GTI and generally use is as the appliance it is, I think my attitude may be a bit different with the R, little more concerned about scratches, dog marring the leather, not sure how you feel about that. From your description, I think the AWD would be a huge plus, weather and confidence and personally would opt for DSG if you getting stuck in traffic with any frequency. As you say, you have to drive it. I still really enjoy the GTI and have yet to rationalize the upgrade, but if I were going in cold and could get an R for 8-9k diff. I might be compelled to take that leap. Either will do the job and put a smile on your face.
 

MonkeyMD

Autocross Champion
I think a good middle ground would be an awd Sportwagen or an Alltrack. More space for the dogs. Awd traction. Better than R fuel economy. And lower price point so you won't be stressed over ruining it, scratching leather etc. And with a tune, you're past stock gti performance
 

Al_in_Philly

Autocross Newbie
Location
Philadelphia USA
One thing you didn't note was how often you tend to push the envelope. If you never drive a car really fast through the corners or put your foot to the floor, then MonkeyMD's (whose avatar frighteningly bears a strong resemblance to my own doctor) recommendation makes more sense than either the GTI or R. If you are someone who regularly needs a little "speed rush" then either will do, unless you like a really big rush, and then the R is the better choice. Or, if you're concerned about always making it through those dumpings that Washington gets when warm southern Gulf air hits a cold Arctic front, well the Golf R on snow tires is almost magical.
 

MDLBC

Ready to race!
Location
NYB
Ironically I came from a 2012 TSX wagon. Believe it or not, I miss the Acura’s navigation, but the facelift model’s may be vastly better. I especially miss the extra space in the boot of my TSX. For a normally aspirated 4 cylinder it performed rather well, especially when you shifted into sport mode for passing. If they offered the estate/wagon R here in the US I would have chosen that for sure. While I have had “sporty” cars in the past, I’ve never had anything like the R. After a year and a half I still can’t wait to get in and drive it. You don’t mention a burning desire for a car with sporty dynamics so I would say maybe get the GTI with the performance pack only because it has a limited slip differential (better traction) amd I’m not sure what other models do in the Golf line. And as you stated, better mpg and a better price. You can usually get a very good price on a GTI. On an R, $1,000 below MSRP if you’re lucky. My wife can’t drive a manual, and I wanted a “reasonable” mid life crisis car, so my decision was easier than most. Finally, I have a Bernese Mountain Dog and I just throw a blanket in the back seat as the kids are usually the ones back there. No damage from her (or them) yet! Just some slobber on the tint...
 

takemorepills

Ready to race!
Location
USA
I am coming up on the end of my 2016 GTI SE DSG lease.
The residual is a bit too high to justify buying the GTI at lease end, but worse yet is my experience with FWD in a rainy place, WA State. I have resolved to NEVER buy a FWD car again.
I had a JB1 on my GTI, and it is an AMAZING vehicle. But, traction is a SERIOUS problem. If it is raining, I couldn't out-pedal a Corolla across an intersection for gawd-sakes! Even without the JB1 the GTI is horrible getting off the line in less than ideal conditions. And I don't mean "as an adult why do I need to take off hard all the time?" I mean like, pulling out into traffic across lanes in the rain, someone coming around a corner you didn't realize was there and even SLIGHTLY squeezing more on the go pedal creates a going-nowhere tire spin that really exposes the faults of so much power in FWD.
And don't buy into the "get the PP it has a diff" crap. The PP will spin tires just as easily as the non-PP.

When we were in AZ recently, the GTI was phenomenal, with mild temps and good traction (and JB1) it is a rocket. But I can't stand the HUGE difference between good conditions and bad conditions with the GTI.

I have been test driving AWD performance vehicles recently to replace the GTI. And, since it rains all the time here, I get to try them out in conditions that shame the GTI. AWD is amazing. I won't deal with FWD ever again, I hereby swear it off forever.

In all of the test driving of AWD cars, my wife and I leave with the impression "OK car, GREAT off the line launch, but the GTI is far superior in nearly every way". I have been given "permission" to get a Golf R should I prefer.


TL;DR get the damned Golf R. A superior machine is a superior machine, end of discussion. If everyone says a GTI is so great (which it damn well is) then an AWD GTI would blow your mind. As drshark said: "borderline supercar". I concur
 

G7Rules

Ready to race!
Location
Midwest
I'm going to have to agree with MonkeyMD on this one. The golf Alltrack or Sportwagon would be the way to go for you. Get an AWD version, tune it, and enjoy the ample rear space for your German Shepherd :)
 

adam1991

Banned
Location
USA
Ironically I came from a 2012 TSX wagon. Believe it or not, I miss the Acura’s navigation, but the facelift model’s may be vastly better. I especially miss the extra space in the boot of my TSX. For a normally aspirated 4 cylinder it performed rather well, especially when you shifted into sport mode for passing. If they offered the estate/wagon R here in the US I would have chosen that for sure.

There's always a used Porsche Macan...
 

cb1111

Newbie
Location
Virginia, USA
There's always a used Porsche Macan...
I have a friend with a Macan - claustrophobic interior (at least in black) and not much more space in the back than a Golf.

Let's face it, performance is all well and good (and gooder) but at the end of the day you'll need to go to HD or the airport, drag the dog around (in the back - with a barrier - I don't want 70lbs whacking me in the back of the head in an accident and she is safer back there too as I've lined the back of the seat and any sharp bits with memory foam.)

Yes, the alltrack or 4motion wagons are things I considered but I think one needs a warranty with VW electrics so tunes are out of the question for me - as it is, I will have to order a harness from Germany for the lights - and my mods will be limited to what is available in the ROW, wheels etc.

I'm not sure that a current VW wagon in the US would bring anything over my current TSX especially since the versions available don't have decent tech or lighting.
 
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