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Coil over opinions/help

KevinC

Autocross Champion
Location
The land of Wyatt Earp & Doc Holliday
Car(s)
'19 Golf R, '21 M2c
You can basically say that about any mod you make. Does anybody really need 500 horsepower that you can't use on the street?

Sure, but "any mod" isn't the topic here, it's coilovers.

Nobody has to justify what they do to anybody else. I have what I have its because I can and its what I like.

Oh ffs, nobody said anybody had to "justify" anything. Of course anyone can do whatever they want to their cars. Again, that's not the point - the guy was looking for recommendations, and that's what he got. If he wants to put a $3k Ohlins suspension on his car to get groceries, more power to him.
 

Chogokin

Autocross Champion
Location
So Cal
Car(s)
GTI Sport | Audi A3
Does anybody know what their spring rates are with the coilover kits they've purchased?

Bilstein B14 per Neuspeed's website,

SPRING RATE:
  • Front: 400 lbs./in
  • Rear: 420 lbs./in
VALVING:
  • Front: 915 / 925
  • Rear: 950 / 715
B6/8 Strut. I believe the B8 is the same as the B6...just shorter.

VALVING
  • 880 rebound / 775 compression
 
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victorofhavoc

Autocross Champion
Location
Kansas City
Bilstein B14 per Neuspeed's website,

SPRING RATE:
  • Front: 400 lbs./in
  • Rear: 420 lbs./in
VALVING:
  • Front: 915 / 925
  • Rear: 950 / 715
B6/8 Strut. I believe the B8 is the same as the B6...just shorter.

VALVING
  • 880 rebound / 775 compression


I've seen these numbers quoted a ton of times. I really have no idea where they came from but they are very wrong.

The B16 and B14 use the same spring, and similar valving, but B16 can go much stiffer and a tad softer through damping. I don't have the damper numbers handy, but I can hunt them down if anyone really cares. When I got my B16 kit in, I actually measured the springs, verified against Bilstein's published specs on their site (They don't give you spring rate, but they give you every other bit of detail around the spring to be able to calculate the rate yourself), and I calculated the rates as:

Front: Progressive 302-398 lbs/in
Rear: Linear 346 lbs/in

This thread has more information about specific kits, and I posted on page 4 to correct the mis-published information on the Bilstein and add more detail on the Ohlins.

I've also heard people say "The B14 is just the B16 on the middle setting" and that also does not sound right. I've ridden on the B14 and they're about as soft as my B16 are on 3 of 10 clicks front and rear. That's a sporty feeling on the street, but you will absolutely feel potholes, expansion joists, cracks in pavement, and slowing down for driveway curbing and speed bumps is a must. On 0, the B16 are underdamped, but feel very nice on the street. Most of the time I run 1 in front and 2 rear, with occasionally going to 3/5 when going for a fun spin. I haven't had them on track yet (so many canceled events this year), but I suspect I will be running 7/9, 8/9, or 8/10.

Hope this helps :)
 

CarolinaPanthers

Passed Driver's Ed
Location
Bethlehem, PA
Car(s)
18 GTI 6mt
The front struts are a single-assembly, no matter whether you're OEM, aftermarket struts/springs, or coilovers. I'm not sure you'd save much hassle if you're trying to make it easier to go back so stock. Not sure it would ever make sense to swap suspensions back to stock, anyway -- unless you have a super high-end ($$$$) coilover setup to resell.

I just put a B12 pro kit together for $800 + strut mounts/bearings + install...

In regards to the B12 kit. I am very tempted by a quality shock/spring set-up! Probably best to set and forget, but I'm sure I'd be upset that I couldn't raise/lower it a hair or easily adjust the damping (Koni Yellow). Sure, once its set I wouldn't touch it again, but ripping apart the rear 2-3x to get there sounds unpleasant.

Uh, when you remove the front assembly, you remove everything as a complete assembly. Doesn't matter if you go coilovers or a spring & strut assembly. You can get all the parts for either (strut mount, bearing, and bump stop if applicable, as Bilsteins monotubes have internal bumpstops, so you don't need external bumpstops) to make it a easy sway back to stock.

To clarify - Yes, I know the fronts come out as one assembly, but I don't want to rip that assembly apart to get the extra pieces for a shock/spring set up. First of all, F spring compressors lol! Secondly, I know I can purchase the pieces needed, but when pricing out a shock/spring set up including new strut mounts, bearing, dust boots, bump stops, spring seats, etc. came within $2-300 of a set of coilovers I'd really like to purchase. At that point. I'd rather save up for a little while longer and get the product I really want.

Same thing with coilovers that need only strut mounts/bearings (e.g., Bilstein B14, ST X/KW V1, et. al,). The price would be close enough that I know I'd regret not splurging a little extra for the set coilovers with some features I've eying up.

As my car is a lease with the intention to buy, the ability to pull out the coilovers to replace most easily replace stock springs/struts has it's benefits for me should I want to turn it in.
 

GTIfan99

Autocross Champion
Location
FL
I've seen these numbers quoted a ton of times. I really have no idea where they came from but they are very wrong.

The B16 and B14 use the same spring, and similar valving, but B16 can go much stiffer and a tad softer through damping. I don't have the damper numbers handy, but I can hunt them down if anyone really cares. When I got my B16 kit in, I actually measured the springs, verified against Bilstein's published specs on their site (They don't give you spring rate, but they give you every other bit of detail around the spring to be able to calculate the rate yourself), and I calculated the rates as:

Front: Progressive 302-398 lbs/in
Rear: Linear 346 lbs/in

This thread has more information about specific kits, and I posted on page 4 to correct the mis-published information on the Bilstein and add more detail on the Ohlins.

I've also heard people say "The B14 is just the B16 on the middle setting" and that also does not sound right. I've ridden on the B14 and they're about as soft as my B16 are on 3 of 10 clicks front and rear. That's a sporty feeling on the street, but you will absolutely feel potholes, expansion joists, cracks in pavement, and slowing down for driveway curbing and speed bumps is a must. On 0, the B16 are underdamped, but feel very nice on the street. Most of the time I run 1 in front and 2 rear, with occasionally going to 3/5 when going for a fun spin. I haven't had them on track yet (so many canceled events this year), but I suspect I will be running 7/9, 8/9, or 8/10.

Hope this helps :)

What wheel tire combo/s are you running? One of the reasons I'll eventually go with a set of coilovers is to make more room for big tires. I'm currently using 225/45 17 on Runlites for street, 245/40 17 on RSe16's for autocross and track, but I want throw RS4's in same size on these wheels to use just for track, and I'm looking at APR's new 18 x 9 offering to use for autocross next year and try to stuff 265/35 18 under the fenders.

I'm currently on APR springs, stock dampeners, and eurosport camber kit and it's a pretty good compromise all the way around, but I don't expect the dampeners to last long.
 

victorofhavoc

Autocross Champion
Location
Kansas City
What wheel tire combo/s are you running? One of the reasons I'll eventually go with a set of coilovers is to make more room for big tires. I'm currently using 225/45 17 on Runlites for street, 245/40 17 on RSe16's for autocross and track, but I want throw RS4's in same size on these wheels to use just for track, and I'm looking at APR's new 18 x 9 offering to use for autocross next year and try to stuff 265/35 18 under the fenders.

I'm currently on APR springs, stock dampeners, and eurosport camber kit and it's a pretty good compromise all the way around, but I don't expect the dampeners to last long.
I ran a 235 RE71R on the stock wheels for a bit, but now run a 225 gmax as05 for the street. I ran a 245/40 on a 17x8 in direzza z3, and now i'm running a 235/45 yoko a052 on a 17x8 rear and 17x9 front. The yoko in 235 are as wide as the direzza in 245 and way wider than the re71r were. I plan to squeeze on a 255/40 front and 225 or 235/45 rear. Coilovers won't change what you can run drastically because the strut is actually mounted fairly high, and the tire doesn't even come up to the perch area for me. The clearance to the strut is what matters most (there's tons of room on the fender if you have a proper offset), and that stays the same regardless of what you run. I'm pretty sure a 255 will fit fine on the strut side, but I'm not confident about a 265, but it really depends on tire. An R888R in a 255 will fit no issue, but a 255 in a yoko a052 might be super close.

To be quite frank, it takes a seriously good driver to tell the difference between a 255 and a 265. We're talking Randy Pobst saying "I can kind of tell...".
 

greekspec2

Drag Racing Champion
Location
California
Car(s)
17 Golf R 17 BMW X1M
Bilstein has a special B14 low version kit that lowers the car 70mm, it was collaborated build with a tuner in Europe. It uses twin tube fronts and mono tube rear shocks and designed to give a excellent ride at a low drop. A lot of guy's in Europe run them but you have to purchase them from select suppliers.

Here is the part number and a link to the tuner who designed it with Bilstein
47-280922

http://deimann-fahrwerktechnik.de/Exklusiv-Anfertigung_Bilstein_B14_XL_tief_VW-Golf-7.html
 
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