Clutchless ignition update: solved (maybe)

[Ridebjj]

Here's a possibly important bit of info I completely forgot about until I was down there cleaning in that area.

There's another direction of movement of the rig which can change how well it works or not.

If, after mounting it all up, you're having trouble with one of the sensors not activating/deactivating, try very gently pulling the solenoid unit towards you, such that it's very slightly pointing the extended magnets more towards the firewall.

If that does the trick, you can put a small spacer object between the solenoid body and the foam on the firewall behind it.

Mine has a little rolled up bit of duct tape stuck in that space to hold it in that position.

I can't believe I forgot this.

 

[Golf7RR]

Here's a possibly important bit of info I completely forgot about until I was down there cleaning in that area.

There's another direction of movement of the rig which can change how well it works or not.

If, after mounting it all up, you're having trouble with one of the sensors not activating/deactivating, try very gently pulling the solenoid unit towards you, such that it's very slightly pointing the extended magnets more towards the firewall.

If that does the trick, you can put a small spacer object between the solenoid body and the foam on the firewall behind it.

Mine has a little rolled up bit of duct tape stuck in that space to hold it in that position.

I can't believe I forgot this.

thanks, i got it working though. i've also found that the strength of the magnetss matter also. i was using rare-earth ones and they are really not needed. the field strength becomes too much and in-retracted position did not allow signal to de-activate..lets hope all this work helps save the thrust-bearings for a longgg-time..thanks again for pioneering this.

 

[oTurtlez]

Welp, after having to out of pocket throw a "new" (VW Reman) engine into my R due to crank walk, I was delighted to find that someone had finally come up with a solution for bypassing the clutch switch!

I ordered everything from the front page as well as a spool of ABS to print out one of those solenoid mounts and will be giving this a crack as soon as I've got the time.

Now one thing that I'd have loved to have seen in here would have been an actual wiring diagram for the entire setup given the involvement of the (optional) timer module and everything else so I whipped one up as seen below:

It's pretty darn similar to the schematic available from the timer manufacturer but it's nice to have this specific setup laid out.

Let me know if I got this right or if we need to tweak anything. I figure this will be helpful to anyone else trying to attempt this without having to go digging or figuring anything else out. My goal was to use AutoCAD Electrical, but good god was that program a nightmare to deal with.

I'll keep my CAD skills in 3D...

 

[Ridebjj]

^^^ That looks right to me.

Thanks. I especially like how it's got the same ghetto hack look to it as everything else to do with this mod.

 

[Golf7RR]

It's pretty darn similar to the schematic available from the timer manufacturer but it's nice to have this specific setup laid out.

Let me know if I got this right or if we need to tweak anything. I figure this will be helpful to anyone else trying to attempt this without having to go digging or figuring anything else out. My goal was to use AutoCAD Electrical, but good god was that program a nightmare to deal with.

I'll keep my CAD skills in 3D...

FYI..I ended up not hooking up to main battery but using an auxiliary sealed cell +12V battery pack with a simple switch, no time-delay relay. The delay to shut-off becomes myself. been working good...knock on wood!

 

[Corprin]

OP, good work on a solution.

I guess I have a fear of fiddling with a VAG’s electronics, so... For the sake of discussion on the subject, would it be plausible to accomplish this this on a more mechanical means? plumb in a solenoid to the clutch bleeder valve then off to a pressure vessel or piston, or some thing. Engage a momentary on switch, solenoid bypasses the clutch line, and the operator’s clutch pedal input doesn’t move the clutch.

 

[Ridebjj]

OP, good work on a solution.

I guess I have a fear of fiddling with a VAG’s electronics, so... For the sake of discussion on the subject, would it be plausible to accomplish this this on a more mechanical means? plumb in a solenoid to the clutch bleeder valve then off to a pressure vessel or piston, or some thing. Engage a momentary on switch, solenoid bypasses the clutch line, and the operator’s clutch pedal input doesn’t move the clutch.

I guess so? As long as a magnet gets moved into and out of position is all that matters. You could hire a small gerbil to sit down there and hold it for you.

 

[El_bigote_AJ]

I guess so? As long as a magnet gets moved into and out of position is all that matters. You could hire a small gerbil to sit down there and hold it for you.

No, what he is explaining would still require an electronic device... basically something that would replace the bleeder nipple at the delay valve, it wouldn’t work that way as the path of travel would still need something to block the flow to the TOB, so you would actually have to replace the whole clutch delay valve with a custom electronically controlled diverter valve that when it was time to start the car you trigger the diverter to bypass the TOB and enter a new fluid reservoir that would have to be at a higher level of diverter so that it’s could still have the free air space on the top for there to be room for the fluid to go and still go back into the system without adding air. The concern with that though would be the constant fluid transfer that could potentially drain the brake reservoir and overfill the new added reservoir over time, so maybe a better way would be to run that diverted line back into the brake reservoir through maybe a custom cap and a hose down Into the bottom of the reservoir so that it’s always submerged and cannot get any air in the System. With that said....lol

But hey you won’t be messing with the VAG electronics. Haha

 

[Ridebjj]

No, what he is explaining would be Still require and electronic device... basically something that would replace the bleeder nipple at the delay valve, it wouldn’t work that way as the path of travel would still need something to block the flow to the TOB, so you would actually have to replace the whole clutch delay valve with Custom electronically controlled diverter valve that when it was time to start the car you trigger the diverter to bypass the TOB and enter a new fluid reservoir that would Have to be at a higher level of diverter so that it’s could still have the free air space on the top for there to be room for the fluid to go and still go back into the system without adding air. The concern with that though would be the constant fluid transfer that could potentially drain the brake reservoir and overfill the new added reservoir over time, so maybe a better way would be to run that diverted line back into the brake reservoir through maybe a custom cap and a hose down Into the bottom of the reservoir so that it’s always submerged and cannot get any air in the System. With that said....lol

But hey you won’t be messing with the VAG electronics. Haha

Ooooooh...

Yea, I completely missed what he meant. He means leave everything as is and just prevent the mechanical actuation of the TB (clutch) when pressing pedal?
Well, I suppose that's possible but seems like beyond nightmare. I'd never want to start messing with fluid systems if at all avoidable. I'd rather hire the gerbil.

 

[oTurtlez]

I'd be hesitant to muck with a pretty crucial hydraulic system as well.

I mean, you COULD use a single action DCV that when the solenoid isn't energized it defaults to standard flow so you're only energizing to redirect flow. In the event of a failure of that circuit it'd just default to standard operation. I just worry that if anything physically fails with that, there goes your clutch pedal mid drive. All it takes is one loose fitting or bad seal in your added component(s) to lose clutch pressure and get stranded on the side of the road.

With the electronic trickery that we've got going on here, worst case is the solenoid triggers randomly and the car cuts itself out of cruise control or something; nothing potentially life threatening can occur. +1 for Gerbil.

 

[Strange Mud]

so I haven't read this thread in a while.....outside the box/Yankee Farmer suggestion.

Why not just run switched 12vdc directly to starter solinoid? Depending on where VW cut ckts you prob still have power everywhere else needed as car runs regardless of clutch pedal position. You'll still have anti-theft from lack of key and all that turns on (engine modules). No idea but this may be a simple solution. It should be easy enough to try

Mud

 

[ATR]

I'm pretty sure that could be done with vcds or OBDEleven. Never tried it though so it might be worth a shot.

 

[El_bigote_AJ]

I'm pretty sure that could be done with vcds or OBDEleven. Never tried it though so it might be worth a shot.

Thank you for the insight.

 

[El_bigote_AJ]

so I haven't read this thread in a while.....outside the box/Yankee Farmer suggestion.

Why not just run switched 12vdc directly to starter solinoid? Depending on where VW cut ckts you prob still have power everywhere else needed as car runs regardless of clutch pedal position. You'll still have anti-theft from lack of key and all that turns on (engine modules). No idea but this may be a simple solution. It should be easy enough to try

Mud

Let us know how it goes, what gauge wire are you planning to run to the starter?

 

[kadaj]

Very nice write up! Amazing!

I've been trying to source all the materials, and I find it hard to get the springs and solenoid.

For some reason the websites linked do not work, and I cannot find the parts online on any other website.

Any tips here? Anything I can get from Amazon or maybe from another website?