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Can I safely do an APR Stage 1 Tune on my new 2021 GTI 6-speed

vw83

Passed Driver's Ed
Location
New York
Car(s)
2021 GTI 6-speed
Yeah, he was very nonchalant about the whole thing. He says they do a lot of them and they rarely have any problems. I've driven a stick shift for over 30 years so that's not the issue. If I know myself I'll think it over for another few weeks and decide not to do it. Most of my driving is around town with some highway stints here and there so what's the point. I have no issue spending $500 to have some fun, but to have to worry about shifting smoothly or blowing my engine or voiding the warranty, it's just not worth it to me. If I owned the car maybe, but it just seems silly given what everyone is saying.
 

SnailpowerMk7

Go Kart Champion
Location
NJ
Car(s)
MK7 GTI SE 6SPD MT
I skipped the majority of posts and say, DO IT! It is a LEASE. DRIVE IT LIKE YOU STOLE IT! Then give it all beat up to the next chump that buys it, rofl. Okay Okay, don't drive it entirely like you stole it because of what I'm about to say...

Actually, with your age (respectfully), you probably have great manual experience and I don't think you will wear the clutch out as soon as these young guns who barely know how to drive the car stock, then throw an additional near 100hp and are like, WAAAH WAAAAH all day long, ripping on the clutch and 3 weeks later are like, 😭😭 my clutch!! 😭😭

If you know how to drive manual perfect from a stock standpoint and don't drive completely like an a$$hat all day long, you're not going to wear out the clutch that quickly. At least I think you can definitely make it through your lease without requiring a replacement or even show enough wear on it that the dealer would care.

If the dealer is cool with flashing a lease, I say, go for it! Consider the power there for fun sprints but don't abuse it. If you think that is worth $500 to enjoy the lease more, do it.
 

NBMK7GTI

Go Kart Newbie
To be honest, I had absolutely zero interest or even awareness of tuning the car until the dealer mentioned it. For $500 it sounded like fun. Now it sounds absurd. The dealer is an APR approved dealer. The actual person in the service department who would do the install said if he installs it, and I do my regular services at the dealership, that I have nothing to worry about. He assured me that nothing is going to happen to my engine. He did say that the clutch could go and that it would only make sense to replace it with an aftermarket clutch ($850+) if that were to occur. He said that if I noticed slippage within the first 10,000 miles they could easily remove the tune and that it would be very unlikely that it would’ve caused damage significant enough to require the clutch to be replaced. Of course I’d be out the $500 for the tune. Finally, he said I could do the low-torque tune which would still add more than enough HP and torque to make it worthwhile, but he couldn’t guarantee this wouldn’t damage the clutch either. He said he’s seen the original VW clutch last 40,000 miles on a stage 1 tune but also seen them go at 20,000. The uncertainty of the whole thing seems like way too much work, and risk...and possibly additional money to go a little bit faster for the next 38 months. Oh well.....but thanks for the helpful input.
The service guy sounds like a snake oil salesman. Considering they don’t wanna replace a clutch as it’s a wear item, I don’t see how that’s getting done while tuned on a lease. If you want the extra power without worrying, get a JB4.
 

the

Autocross Champion
Location
Alabama
Car(s)
GTI
Considering they don’t wanna replace a clutch as it’s a wear item
Is there any situation where a dealer would replace a manual clutch outside of catastrophic failure inside of the bumper to bumper warranty range? It would need to be a manufacturer failure at like 1200 miles.

And in regard to the rest of the thread, the dealership is an APR+ dealer, they are certified to do the tuning to these vehicles. It will be in the service history for the vehicle that the tune was done at the dealership. What am I missing?
 

jimlloyd40

Autocross Champion
Location
Phoenix
Car(s)
2018 SE DSG
Is there any situation where a dealer would replace a manual clutch outside of catastrophic failure inside of the bumper to bumper warranty range? It would need to be a manufacturer failure at like 1200 miles.

And in regard to the rest of the thread, the dealership is an APR+ dealer, they are certified to do the tuning to these vehicles. It will be in the service history for the vehicle that the tune was done at the dealership. What am I missing?
VWOA can still deny warranty coverage because of the tune.
 

JC_451

Autocross Champion
Location
NJ, one of the nice parts.
Car(s)
2017 GTI Sport
The clutch is warrantied for one year or 12k miles.

If they pull it apart and find you've abused it it won't be covered, even early. They also won't warranty it if the car flags TD1.

Personally, I wouldn't tune a leased car. Violating the lease agreement could be a great way to find yourself owing thousands of dollars.
 

Dog Dad Wagon

Autocross Champion
Location
Go Birds
Car(s)
16 Touareg TDI
Probably the same kind of dealer who will then CPO it, even though the power train warranty is pretty much shot.
Agreed
Is there any situation where a dealer would replace a manual clutch outside of catastrophic failure inside of the bumper to bumper warranty range? It would need to be a manufacturer failure at like 1200 miles.

And in regard to the rest of the thread, the dealership is an APR+ dealer, they are certified to do the tuning to these vehicles. It will be in the service history for the vehicle that the tune was done at the dealership. What am I missing?
yes 6MTs are pretty much only covered within the 1 year/12K. It’s a manual, it’s too easy for them to make a shitty clutch and point the finger at the user for it failing at 30K stock miles
 

vw83

Passed Driver's Ed
Location
New York
Car(s)
2021 GTI 6-speed
I contacted APR directly just to see what they'd say. Here's their response:

"Thanks for reaching out. Your concern regarding the clutch is absolutely valid here. These cars are notorious for having fairly weak clutches so slip is deffinelty a concern. What I would say is that overall if you are mindful of it, you can get good life out of the factory clutch without too much issue. My personal car is actually a 2017 GTI MT and it's been tuned since new with various levels of our software. This car started it's life under the ownership of on of my collogues here who tuned it with our stage 2 software. The clutch held up well for the better part of 20k miles on the high torque file before it began to slip. I purchased the car about a year ago and took the car down to our stage 1 low torque software and the clutch has held up for me for another 20k miles. I say all this to say that if you go with the low torque option of our stage 1 software, you should be able to get a lot of useful life out of the factory clutch while still enjoying a substantial jump in power. There is always the chance that your experience will be different, but based on what I've seen over the years here and what I've experienced first hand with my own car, I believe you should be able to take advantage of the tune on the factory clutch."

Not sure if this moves the needle enough to make me go for it, but that lower torque option might be the happy middle ground.
 

launchd

Drag Racing Champion
Location
New York
Car(s)
2023 M3LR, 2021 A7
I contacted APR directly just to see what they'd say. Here's their response:

"Thanks for reaching out. Your concern regarding the clutch is absolutely valid here. These cars are notorious for having fairly weak clutches so slip is deffinelty a concern. What I would say is that overall if you are mindful of it, you can get good life out of the factory clutch without too much issue. My personal car is actually a 2017 GTI MT and it's been tuned since new with various levels of our software. This car started it's life under the ownership of on of my collogues here who tuned it with our stage 2 software. The clutch held up well for the better part of 20k miles on the high torque file before it began to slip. I purchased the car about a year ago and took the car down to our stage 1 low torque software and the clutch has held up for me for another 20k miles. I say all this to say that if you go with the low torque option of our stage 1 software, you should be able to get a lot of useful life out of the factory clutch while still enjoying a substantial jump in power. There is always the chance that your experience will be different, but based on what I've seen over the years here and what I've experienced first hand with my own car, I believe you should be able to take advantage of the tune on the factory clutch."

Not sure if this moves the needle enough to make me go for it, but that lower torque option might be the happy middle ground.

I think you’re missing the point. It’s a lease and modifying a leased vehicle (which you contractually agreed to not do) is taking “pay to play” to a whole new level of risk.

Ask APR if they recommend tuning a leased vehicle, I’m curious what they would say.
 

SnailpowerMk7

Go Kart Champion
Location
NJ
Car(s)
MK7 GTI SE 6SPD MT
I contacted APR directly just to see what they'd say. Here's their response:

"Thanks for reaching out. Your concern regarding the clutch is absolutely valid here. These cars are notorious for having fairly weak clutches so slip is deffinelty a concern. What I would say is that overall if you are mindful of it, you can get good life out of the factory clutch without too much issue. My personal car is actually a 2017 GTI MT and it's been tuned since new with various levels of our software. This car started it's life under the ownership of on of my collogues here who tuned it with our stage 2 software. The clutch held up well for the better part of 20k miles on the high torque file before it began to slip. I purchased the car about a year ago and took the car down to our stage 1 low torque software and the clutch has held up for me for another 20k miles. I say all this to say that if you go with the low torque option of our stage 1 software, you should be able to get a lot of useful life out of the factory clutch while still enjoying a substantial jump in power. There is always the chance that your experience will be different, but based on what I've seen over the years here and what I've experienced first hand with my own car, I believe you should be able to take advantage of the tune on the factory clutch."

Not sure if this moves the needle enough to make me go for it, but that lower torque option might be the happy middle ground.

Do it, do it, do it! lol. Again, you didn't buy the car previously from some one else that may have already abused/weakened the clutch so that you can expect the tune to seriously put a toll on it. You're going from new with clutch experience. I think you'll be fine man.

Some people over analyze these things. I'm usually on the positive side of things and like to believe it "won't" happen to me.

At least go with the low torque file. You will get a substantial boost in powa but also better chance of keeping clutch fine with again, your experience.

When I go stg1, I'm going high torque. I know my clutch is gonna have issues eventually because I didn't buy the car new but the clutch feels good thus far (bought it at 25k miles). The high torque will put extra stress more than likely and if I can get to 40k miles, I'll be happy enough because I don't drive enough to get there that fast. It'll be 15k of very enjoyable miles, lol. When I feel the clutch isn't norm, I'll start doing my clutch research and try to order the parts in advanced to it just blowing out on me.
 

vw83

Passed Driver's Ed
Location
New York
Car(s)
2021 GTI 6-speed
Yeah, I've pretty much decided I'm not doing it....unless the guy at the VW dealer signs off on it, which he won't do. If I'm lucky, I get away with it and just take the tune out before I give the car back. If I'm unlucky, I'm $1000's in the hole. Not worth it. Regarding the "contractual agreement," they obviously don't care. If I was an attorney with a lot of free time, I'd argue that because my dealer offered it to and was fully aware that it was a leased vehicle, VW is at least as responsible for the damage as I am. Otherwise, VW dealerships should be prohibited from offering such products on leased vehicles. I'm not a lawyer, and I'm not up for the aggravation. Thanks for the sound advice.
 

launchd

Drag Racing Champion
Location
New York
Car(s)
2023 M3LR, 2021 A7
I'm just shocked a VW dealer who leased a car would be pushing a flash tune. Even if nothing happens to the car, eventually that car is going to come back to them.

Probably the same kind of dealer who will then CPO it, even though the power train warranty is pretty much shot.

If it comes back to them after the term is up, they will ground it from it's lease and tell Volkswagen they don't want it which will see it sent to auction.

No way a dealership CPOs a car they tuned knowingly and attempts to sell it as such, that will bite them in the ass.
 

Acadia18

Autocross Champion
Location
The Greater Boston Metropolitan Area
Car(s)
2019 Golf R
I think you’re missing the point. It’s a lease and modifying a leased vehicle (which you contractually agreed to not do) is taking “pay to play” to a whole new level of risk.

Ask APR if they recommend tuning a leased vehicle, I’m curious what they would say.

Yeah. The clutch isn't the issue about tuning it. It's modifying the ECU on a leased car.

I'd be curious if he followed up with "Thanks. What are your thoughts of flashing your software on a leased vehicle?" to see what they say.
 
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