Beginner’s Guide / Tips for Buying a Street-Based Suspension

[tigeo]

Not sure if this has been covered, but I have a noob question.

I am thinking about lowering my GTI 0.75”-1.25” on coilovers. During the alignment, is there enough camber adjustment in the OEM suspension to correct the camber to avoid going through tires prematurely?

If they have adjustable camber plates....if not, no, there is no adjustment. You won't have enough neg camber just from the normal lowering range most coilovers adjust to to cause any issues.

 

[mwoodski]

Reading through this and have a few questions.

I plan on track day bro'ing my GSW 4mo a few times. Currently have VWR Golf R wagon springs waiting to go on.

I was thinking about getting the B8's as a damper solution over the stock ones, but I'm guessing it would be better to go with a Koni Yellow in this instance?

Also thinking I should upgrade to the 034 camber mounts as well.

Tires will be 235/40R18 Yokohama Advan Apex's.

 

[enobiko]

Toe kills tires

So... I had them align my car to zero toe. My intent was "close to zero", or maybe "align to factory specs as close to zero as they allow", or maybe even "half way between zero toe and the minimum toe-in specs".
So... will I be killing my tires with zero toe? I do autocross on my PS 4S summer tires, so I'd want semi-aggressive toe-in. What to you suggest for a street-based compromise? (Camber plates are not an option, I race in class GS.)

 

[xXDavidCXx]

So... I had them align my car to zero toe. My intent was "close to zero", or maybe "align to factory specs as close to zero as they allow", or maybe even "half way between zero toe and the minimum toe-in specs".
So... will I be killing my tires with zero toe? I do autocross on my PS 4S summer tires, so I'd want semi-aggressive toe-in. What to you suggest for a street-based compromise? (Camber plates are not an option, I race in class GS.)

This is all wrong....

Zero-toe means the tire is pointed exactly straight forward, so no extra wear.

Semi-aggressive toe-in will ruin your tires and your autocross times due to massive understeer because the rear won't want to go anywhere but straight.

Zero rear-toe will give you no extra toe-related wear, and be less of a hindrance on the autocross course.

I run 1/8 inch total rear toe-out for better autocross performance.

Tires wear way more at an autocross/track than daily driving with toe in or out.

So why not live a little and set a little rear toe-out? This would be extremely helpful for GS.

 

[enobiko]

By "semi-aggresive toe-in" I mean something in between the factory specs, and zero to-in. Zero toe-in is somewhat aggressive, and toe-out is definitely aggressive (my terminology alone...)
The factory specifies toe-in, which should help directional stability, and maybe counter some dynamic toe-out tendencies from the tires' interaction with the road? I think if you start out at zero, you will have a slight amount of toe-out at speed... I'm guessing? Due to the rubber bushings deflecting? Maybe not as much with a non-street "solid bushing" setup, again, I'm guessing.
When I went from factory toe-in alignment to zero toe, I'm not sure I noticed any real difference. My last race of the season, however, I did quite well...

 

[Group N]

I`ve just finished reading this thread (plus many other suspension related threads) as I`m considering a suspension refresh soon.

Mk7 R DSG, (Not DCC) 18" wheels. 38psi/36psi. 235/40/18 Michelin PS5 tyres. 24mm SuperPro rear swaybar.
No track use, the roads I use are mainly rough, undulated, twisty back roads.

I`m currently on standard OE suspension, which generally is fine on good roads but feels tired and crashy sometimes. My main issue is harsh bumps and potholes.

Ideally I don`t want to go any lower than standard ride height, if so it has to be a minimum drop.
My main consideration is some extra comfort and ride quality on poor surfaced roads.

I was leaning toward Bilstein B6s (maybe B8s?) with Eibach springs.
I`d be grateful for any input.

 

[mrmatto]

I`ve just finished reading this thread (plus many other suspension related threads) as I`m considering a suspension refresh soon.

Mk7 R DSG, (Not DCC) 18" wheels. 38psi/36psi. 235/40/18 Michelin PS5 tyres. 24mm SuperPro rear swaybar.
No track use, the roads I use are mainly rough, undulated, twisty back roads.

I`m currently on standard OE suspension, which generally is fine on good roads but feels tired and crashy sometimes. My main issue is harsh bumps and potholes.

Ideally I don`t want to go any lower than standard ride height, if so it has to be a minimum drop.
My main consideration is some extra comfort and ride quality on poor surfaced roads.

I was leaning toward Bilstein B6s (maybe B8s?) with Eibach springs.
I`d be grateful for any input.

If you want extra comfort, going lower and stiffer isn’t gonna get you there lol.

1) Consider downsizing to 17” wheels and 235/45-17 tires. More sidewall for more cushioning.

2) How many mi/km? Simply replacing your worn stock dampers with something equivalent will probably make an improvement.

3) Bilstein B6 on stock springs will be slightly stiffer but may still be an improvement in some ways if your stock dampers are worn. Many people like this upgrade.

4) Koni Special Actives are specifically designed to do what you want and smooth out some of the rough stuff. They’re great on my GTI. You can read my review here: https://www.golfmk7.com/forums/inde...koni-special-actives-with-oem-springs.412313/

…Just one man’s opinion.

 

[tigeo]

I`ve just finished reading this thread (plus many other suspension related threads) as I`m considering a suspension refresh soon.

Mk7 R DSG, (Not DCC) 18" wheels. 38psi/36psi. 235/40/18 Michelin PS5 tyres. 24mm SuperPro rear swaybar.
No track use, the roads I use are mainly rough, undulated, twisty back roads.

I`m currently on standard OE suspension, which generally is fine on good roads but feels tired and crashy sometimes. My main issue is harsh bumps and potholes.

Ideally I don`t want to go any lower than standard ride height, if so it has to be a minimum drop.
My main consideration is some extra comfort and ride quality on poor surfaced roads.

I was leaning toward Bilstein B6s (maybe B8s?) with Eibach springs.
I`d be grateful for any input.

I would focus on dampers and running them on stock springs. You can't can't reduce ride height and at the same time improve ride quality - that's my opinon of course and based on how these cars get lower...you are reducing bump travel and increasing spring rate to make up for it. I like my lowered car's ride but it's not as comfortable as stock.

 

[El_bigote_AJ]

I`ve just finished reading this thread (plus many other suspension related threads) as I`m considering a suspension refresh soon.

Mk7 R DSG, (Not DCC) 18" wheels. 38psi/36psi. 235/40/18 Michelin PS5 tyres. 24mm SuperPro rear swaybar.
No track use, the roads I use are mainly rough, undulated, twisty back roads.

I`m currently on standard OE suspension, which generally is fine on good roads but feels tired and crashy sometimes. My main issue is harsh bumps and potholes.

Ideally I don`t want to go any lower than standard ride height, if so it has to be a minimum drop.
My main consideration is some extra comfort and ride quality on poor surfaced roads.

I was leaning toward Bilstein B6s (maybe B8s?) with Eibach springs.
I`d be grateful for any input.

For me after reading everything you explained you’re looking for I agree with @mrmatto fully on just sticking with oe springs and getting special actives and getting what you’re looking for comfort wise on harder road crashes reducing your travel with shorter harder springs will just make those hard hits even more “crashy”. With the 17s rec. I think since you have ps5s I’m pretty sure those are still quite new with lots of life so I don’t think you would want to drop wheel size just to gain a little comfort while reducing responsiveness.

 

[Group N]

If you want extra comfort, going lower and stiffer isn’t gonna get you there lol.

1) Consider downsizing to 17” wheels and 235/45-17 tires. More sidewall for more cushioning.

2) How many mi/km? Simply replacing your worn stock dampers with something equivalent will probably make an improvement.

3) Bilstein B6 on stock springs will be slightly stiffer but may still be an improvement in some ways if your stock dampers are worn. Many people like this upgrade

If you want extra comfort, going lower and stiffer isn’t gonna get you there lol.

1) Consider downsizing to 17” wheels and 235/45-17 tires. More sidewall for more cushioning.

2) How many mi/km? Simply replacing your worn stock dampers with something equivalent will probably make an improvement.

3) Bilstein B6 on stock springs will be slightly stiffer but may still be an improvement in some ways if your stock dampers are worn. Many people like this upgrade.

4) Koni Special Actives are specifically designed to do what you want and smooth out some of the rough stuff. They’re great on my GTI. You can read my review here: https://www.golfmk7.com/forums/inde...koni-special-actives-with-oem-springs.412313/

…Just one man’s opinion.

I`ll be sticking with 18" wheels. I`m at 60k miles.

Yes, B6s with new stock springs was something I`d considered.

I`ll read your thread on the Koni Specials right now.

Thankyou.

 

[Spanner94]

@Hammersticks, great thread and a good read!

I’ve got a 2017 Golf S that I’d like to lower about 1.5” and give improved pitch control under cornering and braking. Its primary mission is traveling in a straight line over broken pavement in the Midwest, though I’d like to improve its handling and I’m willing to sacrifice a little on ride, but not too much. I already have an NB Miata that I drive when I need an ultimate corning machine.

My current setup is stock shocks and springs, 25mm RSB, and 225/45R-17 Continental ExtremeContact Sports on 17” BBS wheels. Springs and shocks are next. I’m thinking of getting the VW DG springs to get the drop. I’ve also looked at the Eibach Sports and H&R Sports, but I’m concerned that they’ll either drop the car too much or make the ride too harsh. Is that valid or would either be better than VW DGs for what I want to accomplish?

For shocks, I’m looking at the Koni Special Actives, but apparently they shouldn’t be used with lowering springs. I’ve read somewhere (here, I think) that they can handle the VW DG springs. Is that true? If I can’t use the Koni SAs, are Bilsteins the next best option?

Thanks in advance.

 

[tigeo]

@Hammersticks, great thread and a good read!

I’ve got a 2017 Golf S that I’d like to lower about 1.5” and give improved pitch control under cornering and braking. Its primary mission is traveling in a straight line over broken pavement in the Midwest, though I’d like to improve its handling and I’m willing to sacrifice a little on ride, but not too much. I already have an NB Miata that I drive when I need an ultimate corning machine.

My current setup is stock shocks and springs, 25mm RSB, and 225/45R-17 Continental ExtremeContact Sports on 17” BBS wheels. Springs and shocks are next. I’m thinking of getting the VW DG springs to get the drop. I’ve also looked at the Eibach Sports and H&R Sports, but I’m concerned that they’ll either drop the car too much or make the ride too harsh. Is that valid or would either be better than VW DGs for what I want to accomplish?

For shocks, I’m looking at the Koni Special Actives, but apparently they shouldn’t be used with lowering springs. I’ve read somewhere (here, I think) that they can handle the VW DG springs. Is that true? If I can’t use the Koni SAs, are Bilsteins the next best option?

Thanks in advance.

Eibach or H&R springs aren't that much of a increase in rate over stock...just enough to deal with the drop/prevent bottoming out. Paired with sport dampers I can't see where you would be too low or have too rough of a ride. The VW springs will work well, but the drop is v. minor. Keep in mind....the lower you go, the less bump travel you have and the more you will bottom out...it's just the physical restraints of this. The Konis should be just fine on those DG springs. Consider Koni yellows (sports) or Bilstein B8s on the Eibachs/H&Rs.

 

[Spanner94]

Eibach or H&R springs aren't that much of a increase in rate over stock...just enough to deal with the drop/prevent bottoming out. Paired with sport dampers I can't see where you would be too low or have too rough of a ride. The VW springs will work well, but the drop is v. minor. Keep in mind....the lower you go, the less bump travel you have and the more you will bottom out...it's just the physical restraints of this. The Konis should be just fine on those DG springs. Consider Koni yellows (sports) or Bilstein B8s on the Eibachs/H&Rs.

Thanks! Did you mean to say stock dampers in the second sentence above? Mine are still working well, but they'll be replaced at least once while I own the car, so it might as well be now while everything's apart. I want something with rebound damping anyway.

 

[GTIfan99]

If you want extra comfort, going lower and stiffer isn’t gonna get you there lol.

1) Consider downsizing to 17” wheels and 235/45-17 tires. More sidewall for more cushioning.

2) How many mi/km? Simply replacing your worn stock dampers with something equivalent will probably make an improvement.

3) Bilstein B6 on stock springs will be slightly stiffer but may still be an improvement in some ways if your stock dampers are worn. Many people like this upgrade.

4) Koni Special Actives are specifically designed to do what you want and smooth out some of the rough stuff. They’re great on my GTI. You can read my review here: https://www.golfmk7.com/forums/inde...koni-special-actives-with-oem-springs.412313/

…Just one man’s opinion.

I have the Koni sports and have compared back to back with mrmatto's car. The special actives are fantastic riding and miles ahead the the stock shocks. Sports are too stiff for the street only, but a bearable autocross street compromise, but just barely.

 

[TCdaosithui]

been awhile, gent!
I have DG springs with neuspeed RS10 18x8 and conti extremecontact dws06+ 235/40-18, also FSB and RSB on my 2017 GTI S manual. Car will never see track days, I just want something comfortable, so should I look into B6 or even B4? (not sure since DG isn't stock but not exactly lower springs either )
thx in adv