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B4 vs B6 Bilstein (Damptronic)

510danr

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Oakland, CA
Car(s)
2016 GTI Autobahn
I hear ya, sometimes I think we research parts so much that we start over thinking things. I always try to get my brakes and suspension / chassis to a 'street / track' set-up, but I think the B6's over shoot that target a bit towards track. I think especially suspension, it's a bit more complicated to fiddle with to get a great ride since I spend 95+% of the time daily driving it.

I doubt I will go back to B4's after getting the B6's, but I think the next time I want to build and play with a car, skipping on adjustable springs and sticking with Eibach or H&R fixed springs.
What's are reasons to not use stock springs/B6? Aside from looks. I'm tired of dragging the front lip everyday and the B6 will have optimal ride quality on stock springs. With Euro Sport camber pucks I hope understeer won't return at stock height. What am I giving up, handling-wise, stock height/B6? I'm DCC so that limits choices.
 

doctorGolfR

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Boston
Car(s)
MK VII Golf R
What's are reasons to not use stock springs/B6? Aside from looks. I'm tired of dragging the front lip everyday and the B6 will have optimal ride quality on stock springs. With Euro Sport camber pucks I hope understeer won't return at stock height. What am I giving up, handling-wise, stock height/B6? I'm DCC so that limits choices.
After lots of reading I think the B6 damptronic with OEM springs is truly the way to go if you aren’t leaning more towards a track oriented car.

Right now I have a set of B6 damptronics waiting to be installed. I held off because I first wanted to see how the car felt after some recent upgrades. I now have an H&R FSB/RSB, RS3 LCA bushings, CSS knuckles, 034 front subframe collars and rear subframe bushing inserts, and a Eurocode rear upper chassis brace. I still haven’t installed the Eurocode front strut tower bar or the iSweep front lower subframe brace. I’m on stock DCC dampers and OEM springs.

The car handles REALLY well, like a go-kart. The ride is much improved yet still somehow feels underdamped. I suspect the B6 damptronics will address that. I have been wondering about this DSC controller thing, though, as I’ve been reading that the B6 damptronic isn’t monotube but rather twin tube. Makes me wonder if it’s even worth installing versus trying to optimize the OEM dampers with the DSC controller.
 

prime8evolved

Passed Driver's Ed
To add to the confusion, I will throw my setup into the mix.

I am currently running the B4 damptronic with Eibach progressive lowering springs. I also run an 034 Adjustable rear sway bar and a Powerflex bushing kit. (The bushing kit is a PITA and not recommended for the timid or easily defeated)

I track my GOLF R at least 5 times a year. I run a smaller 2.1 mile course and a larger 3.1 mile course. For those in MN area - DCTC with SCCA and Brainerd International Raceway - Donnybrook (3.1) and Competition Course (2.5). I also daily my car in country/city environment. The feel of this combination is fantastic. Race mode is what you expect it to be, Normal is comfortable for daily driving and highway, and I never use Comfort unless I have a long road trip and its one of those concrete roads with the expansion cuts in them.

I am very happy with this setup. My friend who owns a Honda Type R and does similar events also agrees that it feels good for daily/track.

Anytime you try to improve one thing, you sometimes have to give up something else. Performance>Comfort. I didn't find this to be true with this setup.

I have been told that KW also makes a coilover suspension system that also utilizes the DCC system. I am not ready to dish out that kind of money on my hobby quite yet.

Just my 2 cents and experience with my 2017 Golf R.
 

RudyH

Go Kart Champion
Location
Kitchener, ON
What's are reasons to not use stock springs/B6? Aside from looks. I'm tired of dragging the front lip everyday and the B6 will have optimal ride quality on stock springs. With Euro Sport camber pucks I hope understeer won't return at stock height. What am I giving up, handling-wise, stock height/B6? I'm DCC so that limits choices.
well ya looks, and the promise of something better from MSS.

Also lower center of gravity is kind of debatable.
 

RudyH

Go Kart Champion
Location
Kitchener, ON
To add to the confusion, I will throw my setup into the mix.

I am currently running the B4 damptronic with Eibach progressive lowering springs. I also run an 034 Adjustable rear sway bar and a Powerflex bushing kit. (The bushing kit is a PITA and not recommended for the timid or easily defeated)

I track my GOLF R at least 5 times a year. I run a smaller 2.1 mile course and a larger 3.1 mile course. For those in MN area - DCTC with SCCA and Brainerd International Raceway - Donnybrook (3.1) and Competition Course (2.5). I also daily my car in country/city environment. The feel of this combination is fantastic. Race mode is what you expect it to be, Normal is comfortable for daily driving and highway, and I never use Comfort unless I have a long road trip and its one of those concrete roads with the expansion cuts in them.

I am very happy with this setup. My friend who owns a Honda Type R and does similar events also agrees that it feels good for daily/track.

Anytime you try to improve one thing, you sometimes have to give up something else. Performance>Comfort. I didn't find this to be true with this setup.

I have been told that KW also makes a coilover suspension system that also utilizes the DCC system. I am not ready to dish out that kind of money on my hobby quite yet.

Just my 2 cents and experience with my 2017 Golf R.

Ya I was hoping to track this a LOT more, but just never got into it and when I felt excited for the spring to track - COVID shut down everything. It sounds like you *might* be a B6 potential owner, but I agree the B4's are still likely the better way to go. The B6's are a bit more stiffer, but there isn't a road I have really driven on that I can use 'Race' mode with them. Maybe a nicely prep'd track, but when the whole stiff chassis is bouncing around I feel like things are too stiff to be effective.

IMO I think the Eibach springs do tighten things up a bit too I am sure with the B4's, and I think that would be the perfect set-up. Then get a DCC controller if anything just to fine tune things. I assume you can go a bit more stiffer too, but I feel like daily, the B6's you will need to go softer with a DCC controller, and barely use the stiffer end of things regardless.

I must say though, OEM set-up, I enjoyed Normal and Race for DCC. Never used comfort. Now I only use Comfort (daily) and Normal (fun). I need to find somewhere special to use Race
 

doctorGolfR

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Boston
Car(s)
MK VII Golf R
Ya I was hoping to track this a LOT more, but just never got into it and when I felt excited for the spring to track - COVID shut down everything. It sounds like you *might* be a B6 potential owner, but I agree the B4's are still likely the better way to go. The B6's are a bit more stiffer, but there isn't a road I have really driven on that I can use 'Race' mode with them. Maybe a nicely prep'd track, but when the whole stiff chassis is bouncing around I feel like things are too stiff to be effective.

IMO I think the Eibach springs do tighten things up a bit too I am sure with the B4's, and I think that would be the perfect set-up. Then get a DCC controller if anything just to fine tune things. I assume you can go a bit more stiffer too, but I feel like daily, the B6's you will need to go softer with a DCC controller, and barely use the stiffer end of things regardless.

I must say though, OEM set-up, I enjoyed Normal and Race for DCC. Never used comfort. Now I only use Comfort (daily) and Normal (fun). I need to find somewhere special to use Race
I guess that’s the question one has to ask themselves: do you want to live more in the normal/race modes (B4) or the comfort/normal modes (B6) because it seems that either way one end of the spectrum is ultimately avoided from everything I have read.

B4 + OEM springs = maybe not much difference

B4 + Eibach pro kit = good combo but loss of ride height

B6 + OEM springs = likely the best compromise to retain ride height / what Bilstein actually made the dampers for

B6 + Eibach pro kit = maybe too stiff for some and loss of ride height
 

RudyH

Go Kart Champion
Location
Kitchener, ON
Ya I feel like that is a great summary - are you already on the B6 + OEM springs?

One of my problems is, here in Ontario the roads are pretty good, but then I head up to Montreal, QC where my wife's family is and the B6's with springs it's terrible. Not sure how much travelling out of the Boston area you do, to compare their roads to others...when I visited Boston 4 yrs ago we had a Mercedes SUV so it wasn't really a great comparison to the R's suspension at all.
 

doctorGolfR

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Boston
Car(s)
MK VII Golf R
Ya I feel like that is a great summary - are you already on the B6 + OEM springs?

One of my problems is, here in Ontario the roads are pretty good, but then I head up to Montreal, QC where my wife's family is and the B6's with springs it's terrible. Not sure how much travelling out of the Boston area you do, to compare their roads to others...when I visited Boston 4 yrs ago we had a Mercedes SUV so it wasn't really a great comparison to the R's suspension at all.
I have been back and forth with OEM springs vs Eibach pro kit springs for the B6 damptronic. I have the dampers sitting in my garage, but I am leaning towards the OEM spring route and will probably wait until Spring at this point to install.

For what they are, I enjoy the OEM dampers now—and I’m in race mode 100% of the time even on crappy Boston roads. I find that the DCC in race mode on these bad roads is still way better than any car I have owned (all Japanese) in the past. I assume that since I already live in/tolerate that end of the spectrum then I would likely love the B6 in comfort/normal mode.
 

Cuzoe

Autocross Champion
Location
Los Angeles
I have been back and forth with OEM springs vs Eibach pro kit springs for the B6 damptronic. I have the dampers sitting in my garage, but I am leaning towards the OEM spring route and will probably wait until Spring at this point to install.

For what they are, I enjoy the OEM dampers now—and I’m in race mode 100% of the time even on crappy Boston roads. I find that the DCC in race mode on these bad roads is still way better than any car I have owned (all Japanese) in the past. I assume that since I already live in/tolerate that end of the spectrum then I would likely love the B6 in comfort/normal mode.
Race mode 100% of the time :eek:, you are a monster o_O.
 
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