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Another failed thrust bearing victim :(

jimlloyd40

Autocross Newbie
Location
Phoenix
Ride
2018 SE DSG
He's not correct but he is not wrong. I think what he was trying to get at is how the is20 delivers hp and tq is comparison to the is38. The is20 delivers more torque than it does power while the is38 delivers more power than torque. If you have an is20, if you want to get to 330 whp you'll be at almost 400 wtq. If you have an is38 and want 330 whp, you'll be pushing right around 320 wtq. With that in mind, you do in fact push the car harder with an is38 but you're pushing a lower amount of torque.
On my dyno print out when my car is hitting 330 WHP it's producing 401 WTQ. That's at 3200 RPM. That's with the IS38 so your theory is incorrect.
 

euroadb

Go Kart Champion
Location
central NJ
Every dyno graph I look at always has is38 at slightly higher peak torque as compared to stage 2 is20, so I'm not sure. But then again I'm only looking at dyno graphs from canned tuning companies. But the numbers always seem close enough, regardless.
 

jimlloyd40

Autocross Newbie
Location
Phoenix
Ride
2018 SE DSG
How not? Have you not seen is38 Dyno graphs?
Are you boosting 32 psi at 3000 and it drops to 14 psi by redline?
I read my dyno printout wrong. My IS20 produced slightly higher torque numbers below 3000 RPM. At 3250 RPM the IS20 and the IS38 are equal and then the IS38 is much higher the rest of the RPM range.
 

GTI Jake

Drag Racing Champion
Location
Charlotte, NC
Does anyone know if crankwalk damages the clutch, flywheel, or pressure plate at all? I'm curious if I can reuse them or not. Or if it's even a good idea at all.
It will not effect the clutch. I personally know of a DKM stage 3 car that suffered crank walk. The dealership re installed his clutch with the new engine
 

euroadb

Go Kart Champion
Location
central NJ
It will not effect the clutch. I personally know of a DKM stage 3 car that suffered crank walk. The dealership re installed his clutch with the new engine
Thanks good to know (y)

Does anyone know how much pressure the DKM stage 2 and DKM stage 3 twin disc pressure plates provide?
I'm trying to put the lightest pressure possible on the crank that will still reliably hold is38 torque.
Isn't the twin disc pressure plate supposed to be relatively light, considering all the extra surface area from the two clutch discs?
So far I'm thinking southbend stage 2 daily or BFI stage 2 should have a lighter pressure plate than the DKM stage 2, i think?
 

Hoon

Drag Racing Champion
Location
Rhode Island
I've made over 430wtq on both IS20s and IS38s.

IS38 will make more when tuned the same, but a high TQ tune on either turbo is a negligible difference in stress on the clutch.
 

Hoon

Drag Racing Champion
Location
Rhode Island
What setup were you running where you were making 430wtq?
A few of them lol

IS20, FBO, stock fuel system on E50 (self tuned). Made 427wtq

IS38 FBO w/ HPFP on E50 (Cobb/Stratified) Made 434wtq

Vortex XL w/ MPI and E85 (Self tuned) Limiting the TQ to 420ish because stock motor, capable of a lot more.
 

GTI Jake

Drag Racing Champion
Location
Charlotte, NC
People put way too much thought into the clutch options for this car.

Crank walk is caused by improperly installed thrust bearings, not the clutch. I have been running my dkm MS twin disk for over 37,000 of my total 86,000 miles with zero issues.

I don’t think any clutch manufacturers even post pressure plate ratings for these cars. Diesel trucks and other popular platforms yes, but I’ve never noticed them posted for MQB
 

euroadb

Go Kart Champion
Location
central NJ
People put way too much thought into the clutch options for this car.

Crank walk is caused by improperly installed thrust bearings, not the clutch. I have been running my dkm MS twin disk for over 37,000 of my total 86,000 miles with zero issues.

I don’t think any clutch manufacturers even post pressure plate ratings for these cars. Diesel trucks and other popular platforms yes, but I’ve never noticed them posted for MQB
BFI posts their pressure plate ratings. They use a 2500 lb pressure plate for stage 2 and 3. How do you like the twin disc? Do you happen to know the rating of that pressure plate?
 

GTI Jake

Drag Racing Champion
Location
Charlotte, NC
BFI posts their pressure plate ratings. They use a 2500 lb pressure plate for stage 2 and 3. How do you like the twin disc? Do you happen to know the rating of that pressure plate?
I love it, zero issues on my daily commute and it takes track abuse like a champ.

No clue on the pressure plate rating, but just an FYI

-BFI clutch kits are built by Clutch Masters

-DKM is actually Competition Clutch (same address, phone number, ect).

You can look up specs and info easier going straight to the source if you feel the need, however I’d recommend sticking with what you’ve got unless it’s notably worn or otherwise having issues. A clutch is a wear item and worth peanuts used. You might as well get your moneys worth out of it as which clutch you’re running won’t effect the probability of crank walk happening again (IMO of course)
 

euroadb

Go Kart Champion
Location
central NJ
You might as well get your moneys worth out of it as which clutch you’re running won’t effect the probability of crank walk happening again (IMO of course)
How sure are you of that? So you're saying my clutch probably isn't ruined and my DKM pressure plate isn't increasing my risk of crankwalking again?
 

Hoon

Drag Racing Champion
Location
Rhode Island
Crank walk is caused by improperly installed thrust bearings, not the clutch. I have been running my dkm MS twin disk for over 37,000 of my total 86,000 miles with zero issues.
Sorry Jake but I'm not with you on this one.

The force to overcome the pressure plate is against the thrust bearing, one small 180 degree washer, essentially, holding 2500+ lbs of force. The heavier the pressure plate the more stress on the bearing. This is reinforced by the much lower failure rate of cars running stock clutches.

I also don't know how you would install them wrong. The clearance is so tight I don't see a way that the assembly would fit together if they aren't in the right spot. We're talking a couple thousandths of an inch. After they wear they can fall out of place, but this is an effect and not a cause.
 

Stija

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Az
Ride
BMW Saab Subaru VW
2500lb pressure plate may not translate to 2500lb actual pressure on the crank when you depress the clutch pedal.
 

GTI Jake

Drag Racing Champion
Location
Charlotte, NC
If you get crank walk again you’ve got literally the worst luck in the world. You’re more likely to hit the Mega Millions. I’m speaking from personal experience that your clutch was not damaged by crankwalk. With that said I have no idea what condition it’s in from your driving style, mileage or installation/removal by whoevers working on your car.

HOON, I take no offense if you disagree, but I’m not convinced aftermarket clutches have anything to do with it.

I’ve never torn a Gen 3 TSI down to mess with the thrust bearings and honesty hope I never do. However the issue lies in the installation or the design or both. It happens to all years, modded or stock, high and low mileage.

Our local dealership claims to have warrantied bone stock 2019s for crankwalk, as well as every other year dating back to 2015
 

Stija

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Az
Ride
BMW Saab Subaru VW
I know, I’m just saying that just cuz a clutch pp is rated at 2500lb clamping force that does NOT mean it takes 2500lb pressure on crank when you depress the pedal. Point being, not so sure that is the source of crank walk.
 

euroadb

Go Kart Champion
Location
central NJ
I know, I’m just saying that just cuz a clutch pp is rated at 2500lb clamping force that does NOT mean it takes 2500lb pressure on crank when you depress the pedal. Point being, not so sure that is the source of crank walk.
by bad I reread the above posts and misunderstood what you meant
 
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