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4/10/24 Track Night @ HHR - Stormy attempts a FWD lap record (how will it end?)

GoatAutomotive

Autocross Champion
Location
Georgetown, TX
Car(s)
2017 VW GTI SE, DSG
Wth. Highway i get 35mpg at 80, around 30 at 90. Unless I'm running E40, then it's 27.

Now in town is more like 25 & 20 E40
Manual transmission

2900lb car

1.8L

That’s why. 😎

The 6-spd DSGs are a cheat code for Performance, but they take a nasty hit on gas mileage compared to the manual cars.

This has been true all the way back to the days when I worked for Volkswagen of America, and was selling Mk5 GTIs and GLIs to repeat customers. (2006-2008)

Customers who moved to a DSG complained of a 3-5mpg drop in mileage.

At this point, I’m just trying to optimize the total combination I have on the car for performance and utility, as well as mechanical health.
 

GoatAutomotive

Autocross Champion
Location
Georgetown, TX
Car(s)
2017 VW GTI SE, DSG
What was center axle to fender measurement for the 034 S3 springs?
Just now, in the shade in a parking lot. Not perfectly flat ground, but it’s what we got.

This is the non-MR 034 Audi S3 springs. Direct fitment for other MQB cars.

Perhaps the previous owner was a husky fella and liked the larger ladies? 🤷‍♂️ 🤫

Or I drew the short straw.

Someone had to try it, though! 😎 😏
 

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GoatAutomotive

Autocross Champion
Location
Georgetown, TX
Car(s)
2017 VW GTI SE, DSG
Were the S3 springs cut shorter than the stock MK7 springs? Only explanation I can think of
They are designed to lower the S3 0.75” from stock, they’re definitely shorter than stock Mk7 GTI springs.

I Believe they were equal in height (free length) to the H&R OE sport Springs that I removed .

When they come off this week, I will compare them to my stock GTI springs, and also to the Golf R Eibachs.

2018 Golf R Springs should be here Wednesday.

I had no idea what a suspension voyage I was embarking on when I first opened this can of worms. 🐛 👀

Things I try not to think about at night: a $1200-1400 set of ST XA coilovers could’ve save me from this whole ordeal!

…but then what would we have learned? 😆 😎

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GoatAutomotive

Autocross Champion
Location
Georgetown, TX
Car(s)
2017 VW GTI SE, DSG
This is the look, I was going for, BTW:

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GoatAutomotive

Autocross Champion
Location
Georgetown, TX
Car(s)
2017 VW GTI SE, DSG
4/28 updates:

1) 2018 Golf R springs are here. Seller was a fantastic dude to work with. Install this week but it will be a few days (I'm buried in end of month work)


2) I'm registered for the May 8 track day @ HHR to make up for all that went wrong for the 4/10 deal.

Hindsight shows that, even if I'd gotten everything installed in time for 4/10, these lingering issues still would have prevented me from going. i.e. - I couldn't run my new chubby race tires and wheels with these front springs riding the bump stops.


3) Did a light shakedown pass yesterday afternoon at LCR (our local tail of the dragon)...and I stand by my previous research/vision:

...if these front springs were a half inch taller @ static, I would be in HEAVEN. Car is SO close to being dialed in!

The added rigidity from the solid aluminum LCAs and locking subframe kit make the steering and power application light years better.

Yes, it's common knowledge for a lot of folks on here - "rigid front end parts are moar good-er": just reiterating my satisfaction and enjoyment for anyone considering these upgrades, their merit, etc.

Currently looking forward to the improved ground clearance and ride quality from the Golf R springs (they'll raise me up about 12-15mm up front), and simultaneously dreading the IC install that desperately needs to happen.

I'll start with just the front Golf R springs, and keep the 400lb/in S3 rears I have. Ideal? Nope. But the ride height and spring rate have been solid so far on the rears.

I bought the rear 2018 Golf R springs as well, so I can go softer back there if I desire, but that's a step backwards in terms of track prep.

Basically, this is the end of the line: if I can't make these springs work for me, then B16 coilovers from FCP Euro get the nod (or ST XAs with custom spring colors)

That is all for now, folks. 10 days out from the true day of testing.

Thanks for following along thus far!



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GoatAutomotive

Autocross Champion
Location
Georgetown, TX
Car(s)
2017 VW GTI SE, DSG
Folks asked about measurements for the static ride heights on these 034 S3 springs...this morning was the first time the car has been parked on a flat, level slab to take true measurements. I only checked the left side (driver), and here are the findings:

[Wheel hub center to fender lip]
Front: 12.8" = ~325mm
Rear: 13.8" = ~350mm

[Using 245/40R18 Michelin PS4S rubber on 18x8.5" wheels...]

Rear is just under a 2-finger gap (which is actually my target for how this car gets used)
Front is no-finger...you have to snake your index up and over it, maybe buy it a drink first and play some Sade or Barry White.

No bueno!

Target: 350mm all around, +/- 5mm and I will be one happy goat...

1714397048266.png
 

Jmitchell4873

Autocross Champion
Location
Fort Leonard Wood, MO
Car(s)
Mk8 GTI
Rear is just under a 2-finger gap (which is actually my target for how this car gets used)
Front is no-finger...you have to snake your index up and over it, maybe buy it a drink first and play some Sade or Barry White.

No bueno!

Target: MORE THAN TWO FINGERS I will be one happy goat...

View attachment 303929
FIFY::


Got it. Less than one finger is bad. Two or more is good.

1714400519827.png



I've got some Mk8 GTI springs, if you'd like to try something else before you drop more money on coilovers. I'm not sure of the actual part number, but I thought that I read they were possibly .25" lower than the Mk7 version. I could pull them out of storage and get you some measurements if you're interested.
 

GoatAutomotive

Autocross Champion
Location
Georgetown, TX
Car(s)
2017 VW GTI SE, DSG
FIFY::


Got it. Less than one finger is bad. Two or more is good.

View attachment 303938


I've got some Mk8 GTI springs, if you'd like to try something else before you drop more money on coilovers. I'm not sure of the actual part number, but I thought that I read they were possibly .25" lower than the Mk7 version. I could pull them out of storage and get you some measurements if you're interested.
Loving you for this classic throwback to Stiffler/Road Trip right now... 🍻 😆 👏

I haven't researched the Mk8 springs at all. I honesty don't want to. I have insane hours invested just to learn what data I have on the current spring combos:

-Neuspeed Sport springs for GTI, Golf R, S3 and RS3 (multiple kits and ride heights)
-034 Dynamic springs (same 4 applications above)
-APR springs (they have 2 revisions for this platform, + their S3/RS3 springs are on clearance right now)
-OE VW spring heights year to year for 2015-2021 GTI & 2016-2019 Golf R


The time I've invested (unwillingly...had no idea the rabbit hole I would go down) has cost me far more than if I had simply sprung for ANY $1200-1700 coilover setup and just worked 6-10 extra hours in the shop to pay for it.

The additional installs alone are very costly:

I'm not paying someone, as I do this professionally and have a shop, but I'm using my physical time for a half day install or longer each time I change springs or dampers. So it's a very real opportunity cost, versus money I could have made wrenching on a customer vehicle.

Hope this makes sense in writing.
 

GoatAutomotive

Autocross Champion
Location
Georgetown, TX
Car(s)
2017 VW GTI SE, DSG

Jmitchell4873

Autocross Champion
Location
Fort Leonard Wood, MO
Car(s)
Mk8 GTI
The additional installs alone are very costly:

I'm not paying someone, as I do this professionally and have a shop, but I'm using my physical time for a half day install or longer each time I change springs or dampers. So it's a very real opportunity cost, versus money I could have made wrenching on a customer vehicle.

Hope this makes sense in writing.
I guess I only have one more question then. At what point do you draw the line for time/money invested into trying to find the perfect combo?

I know that hindsight is almost always 20/20, hopefully you'll nail the setup that you're shooting for on the next attempt.
 

GoatAutomotive

Autocross Champion
Location
Georgetown, TX
Car(s)
2017 VW GTI SE, DSG
I guess I only have one more question then. At what point do you draw the line for time/money invested into trying to find the perfect combo?

I know that hindsight is almost always 20/20, hopefully you'll nail the setup that you're shooting for on the next attempt.
I thought the line was the 034 Springs… Now it’s the Mk7.5 R Springs.

I already talked to ST this morning about availability and turnaround time on their XA coil over kit. I need to call FCP Euro and ask about the B16 availability so I know my options.
 

MrTSI

Ready to race!
Location
Somewhere south of Montreal, Canada
Car(s)
2024 GTI 380
Personally, I would go XTA for a street/track setup. The ST XA for the MK7 GTI uses the same progressive rate springs, front and rear, as the KW V1, V2, and V3. While KW won't say it outright, the XA, on paper, is the KW V2 minus the stainless steel strut housings. Really nice kit at an amazing price, but for $200 more, you get some really snazzy added features in the XTA.

The XTA starts with the same rebound adjustable dampers as the XA but adds linear springs and sealed monoball camber plates borrowed from the KW Clubsport kits, and the option for custom spring colors and rates. Amazing bang for buck and extra camber for the track.

Their linear spring numbering system lists the rate in N/mm and the length in mm. The standard springs on the XTA are currently 70-170 in the front, 50-200 rear according to the documentation on the German website (https://docs.kwsuspension.de/ea-STXTA-h1828080N.pdf)
To get the rate in lbs/inch units, multiply by 5.7. So 399lbs/in front, 285lbs/in rear.

The XTA gets generally positive reviews in the MK7 and MK6 crowds. HYDE16's review for the MK6 is quite detailed.

https://www.golfmk7.com/forums/index.php?threads/daily-driven-coils.340452/page-2

https://www.golfmk7.com/forums/inde...vers-vs-bc-racing-br-series-coilovers.385839/

https://www.drivingline.com/article...stalling-st-xta-coilovers-on-our-project-gti/

https://www.golfmk6.com/forums/index.php?threads/hyde16-reviews-st-xta-coilover-kit.284671/
 
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