Street Touring Hatchback (STH) discussion/setup

[jimlloyd40]

Not class legal.

Darn

 

[xXDavidCXx]

Not class legal.

Are you sure?

H. Longitudinal (fore-aft) subframe connectors (“SFCs”) are permitted with the following restrictions:
1. They must only connect previously unconnected boxed frame rails on unibody vehicles.
2. Each SFC must attach at no more than 3 points on the unibody (e.g., front, rear, and one point in between such as a seat mount brace or rocker box brace).
3. SFCs must be bolted in place and not welded.
4. No cutting of OE subframes or floorpan stampings is permitted. Drilling is permitted for mounting bolts only.
5. No cross-car/lateral/triangulated connections directly between the driver’s side and passenger’s side SFCs are permitted. Connections to OE components such as tunnel braces or closure panels via bolts are allowed and count as the third point of attachment. No alteration to the OE components is permitted.
6. SFCs may not be used to attach other components (including but not limited to torque arm front mounts or driveshaft loops) and may serve no other purpose.

 

[JackRabbitSLIM]

The alignment shop shouldn't have touched your subframe bolts. You should still check them by looking for witness marks and putting a torque wrench on them to be safe. But I'm guessing that rack is messed up or the person operating it didn't know what their doing. The second has been proven. Alignment racks aren't nearly as repeatable as we'd hope btw. We have a calibrated one at work and lots of special work has gone into it to make it the most accurate/repeatable and there is still some to be desired. Getting different numbers when the car goes back on a rack isn't surprising to me.

Check that everything is tight -> re-align (somewhere else) -> check it -> stop thinking about it.

Pretty sure this makes that brace illegal, it doesn't seem very longitudinal to me.
5. No cross-car/lateral/triangulated connections directly between the driver’s side and passenger’s side SFCs are permitted. Connections to OE components such as tunnel braces or closure panels via bolts are allowed and count as the third point of attachment. No alteration to the OE components is permitted.

 

[GTIfan99]

The alignment shop shouldn't have touched your subframe bolts. You should still check them by looking for witness marks and putting a torque wrench on them to be safe. But I'm guessing that rack is messed up or the person operating it didn't know what their doing. The second has been proven. Alignment racks aren't nearly as repeatable as we'd hope btw. We have a calibrated one at work and lots of special work has gone into it to make it the most accurate/repeatable and there is still some to be desired. Getting different numbers when the car goes back on a rack isn't surprising to me.

Check that everything is tight -> re-align (somewhere else) -> check it -> stop thinking about it.

Pretty sure this makes that brace illegal, it doesn't seem very longitudinal to me.
5. No cross-car/lateral/triangulated connections directly between the driver’s side and passenger’s side SFCs are permitted. Connections to OE components such as tunnel braces or closure panels via bolts are allowed and count as the third point of attachment. No alteration to the OE components is permitted.

Alignment is a moving target, because the suspension isn't static and it's affected even by adjustment of the other corners slightly moving the suspension. And most shops won't let you sit in the driver's seat while aligning.

A full degree difference from side to side isn't within that margin though.

But yeah, getting an exact Alignment isn't really even possible.

 

[GTIfan99]

Local shop recommended trying these.

https://www.ecstuning.com/b-tyrolsp...ehWfthjnxRSOlhkmo2FHD72eRPG9O2CIaAskoEALw_wcB

 

[GTIfan99]

Anyone know the torque specs for rear subframe bolts?

3 ugga duggas?

 

[theDoktor]

Nope. All those fasteners are SINGLE USE, "Stretch-to-torque" type. They ALL need to be replaced. Use the torque values in the Factory Service Manual plus the number of degrees of additional turn needed.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/9b7sfl3rmlw5j42/AADtPKlFvDNecWJ9owhYqbzna?dl=0

 

[bfury5]

Nope. All those fasteners are SINGLE USE, "Stretch-to-torque" type. They ALL need to be replaced. Use the torque values in the Factory Service Manual plus the number of degrees of additional turn needed.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/9b7sfl3rmlw5j42/AADtPKlFvDNecWJ9owhYqbzna?dl=0

This. I've had these saved since week two of ownership. So easy get things done when there are instructions like this (recently pulled the center console, not nearly as bad as I thought it would be)

 

[JackRabbitSLIM]

Rear subframe, 70 Nm + 180deg

If anyone doesn't already know about Erwin manuals, they are amazing. It's all of the service documents: torque info, wiring, DTC info, etc. I think I paid ~$30 and you get 24 hrs to download as much as you want. I downloaded the service info for MK5, 6, and 7 GTIs for example.
https://erwin.vw.com/erwin/showHome.do

 

[xXDavidCXx]

Fast track is out and my letter clarifying mechanical vs VAQ diffs was answered.

 

[aroundomaha]

Fast track is out and my letter clarifying mechanical vs VAQ diffs was answered.

View attachment 203822

Does that mean yes or no to an after market diff in STH?

 

[jmblur]

Does that mean yes or no to an after market diff in STH?

Sounds like "yes" to me!

 

[xXDavidCXx]

Does that mean yes or no to an after market diff in STH?

It's always been yes, except I didn't think it was clear if you already had the VAQ.

If you look at the protest in 2019 about the MK6 R with an aftermarket diff, the protest committee defined the center VAQ diff as a diff, so I wanted clarification if I could essentially have two diffs.

In this case, I think the SEB wants to help FWD cars.

 

[jmblur]

Here's the rule citation.

14.10.K. Limited Slip Differentials
1. STS class: No limited slip differentials are permitted except for fac-
tory standard viscous coupler-type units.
2. STU, STR, and STX classes: 2WD vehicles may use any mechanical
LSD unit. AWD vehicles may substitute one differential 9front, rear,
or center) with an aftermarket mechanical LSD.
STH: 2WD vehicles may use any mechanical LSD unit.

I read this as all mk7s can add one mechanical LSD, including R's. Damn it, now I have another item on my wish list

 

[JackRabbitSLIM]

Here's the rule citation.



I read this as all mk7s can add one mechanical LSD, including R's. Damn it, now I have another item on my wish list

This used to say something different and it was wrong, so now it says nothing.