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From MK6 GTI to MK7 Alltrack?

BillyBob

is afraid of the dyno...
Location
New Jersey
Car(s)
'12 4 door GTI
All,

Been almost 3 years since I've been here. Still driving my MK6, which has just crested 61K. However, things in the job field have changed, and I am forced to make a decision in the near future about what I should do.
The GTI will be due for a timing chain, suspension check/ component replacement and carbon cleaning within the next 10K. It has one rear end accident under its belt, which resulted in a bumper and hatch replacement. It's maybe worth $11K trade in, and the work (at dealership) would probably be around 3K or so. Everything has been done at my dealership, as it is tuner friendly.
I do a bit of work that takes me off road. Nothing real crazy, but AWD could really be helpful. Also ground clearance is needed, which is what is ruling out a golf R and Sportwagen with 4-motion. Still, I want it to feel similar to the GTI. But I know it won't be as nimble. I did take one out on a test drive and you knew there was more car under heavy cornering. However, the feel of the car is familiar, as it is from the golf family.
I think with a tune, possible swap to GTI turbo and suspension upgrades like swaybars, Unibrace and maybe some upgraded dampeners, I may get what I'm looking for. Sadly the only springs I see out there are the Eibach kit, which dumps the car about 2". I Would rather not go full air suspension, as I do not trust airbags for suspension, and have see others stuck on the side of the road due to the malfunctioning. I am unsure if there is anything offered to just uncrease height using air suspension, like a 2" raise. I think chrystler trucks have had this in the past?

I suppose before I go further, What is out there for these Alltracks to try and make them as Golf R/ GTI-esque in their handling and performance?
 

Jozooka

Go Kart Newbie
Location
Bucks County, PA
I drove an Alltrack as a loaner a few weeks after getting the GTI and instantly thought, "if this only had the same power as the GTI..." With more HP and a a little better handling, the Alltrack would be a much more versatile car than the GTI. I think the trade-off in handling would be worth it for the extra space and AWD, and ground clearance in your case.
 

sprinks

Drag Racing Champion
Location
United States
Looks like you have a few points that need to be broken out:

Gti, golf r, sportwagen, and alltrack are all platform mates. That said platform is very modular, allowing for parts to be used between vehicles (for the most part; drivetrain limitations apply, fwd parts swap with other fwd parts, awd parts swap with awd parts. Engine parts are most all swappable with little exception).

Lifting the alltrack gets in the territory of the unknown as i don't think there are many doing it. Could look at something like a tiguan spring/shock swap to see if that would lift it further, but i wouldn't be surprised if the alltrack already shares those components. This is how the tdi forums and previous golf platforms use to lift their cars. Another option for temporary lift is airbag helper spring inserts. Truck folks (and tdi folks) use them for towing when a towed load would cause the rear to squat.

As for upgrades, again aftermarket supports it well, largely in part due to interchangeable parts from the larger tuner vehicles like the golf r.

As for "golf r/gti-esque" in handling and performance i can't speak to that. The whole thing about the golf r and gti handling comes to low center of gravity and stiffer suspension. The souped up engine performance is certainly apart of its performance and easily solved with a flash-tune or tunebox. It's the physics of handling that will be the tricky part if you want even higher than stock-lift on the alltrack.
 

Dad_wagon

New member
These types of threads always crack me up. It reminds me of those episodes of House Hunters where couples want a beach house close to the city and want to pay $1000 a month... it’s not going to happen.

You are going to have to choose between driving experience and versatility IF you truly need ground clearance as you mentioned. I have an Alltrack with EMD Auto springs, a Neuspeed power module, 034 motor sports dogbone insert, and ecs intake tube with k&n filter and the Alltrack is a completely different car from when I drove it off the lot. If you want the GTI driving experience you are going to have to add some mods. If you are worried about ground clearance then the stock Alltrack suspension will do just fine, but don’t expect it to corner like a GTI.

It’s time to choose which feature is most important to you, and go into the decision with realistic expectations. IHTH


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

euroadb

Go Kart Champion
Location
central NJ
I think the alltrack is a good compromise. You're getting the AWD and ground clearance you wanted from the start, and it still feels like a golf ultimately. It might not handle like a GTI, but at least it will be more comfy and practical. You can also add a tune and turbo if you want and it will be on par or more, power-wise, with the GTI. Maybe look into if DCC is available on the alltrack. Maybe it can stiffen up the damping to a level you will like?

I have air suspension and while I wouldn't call it completely unreliable if set up properly, I feel like it's definitely not appropriate for lifting past stock height for regular driving, and will be a challenge set up to reach alltrack height.
 
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joofcorn

Ready to race!
Location
IL
The Alltrack handling isn't really all bad on its own. I came from a mk6 GTI (tune and dp), and while the Alltrack certainly has more body roll, it is still very well composed. I really need to push this car to get to a point when body roll starts to become an issue. Plus the AWD does make up for some of that loss.
 

BillyBob

is afraid of the dyno...
Location
New Jersey
Car(s)
'12 4 door GTI
To clarify, I know it will not handle like my or any other GTI, but I don't want it to have as much body roll as it does now.
I think with the proper swaybars, Bilstein B6 dampeners (longer travel than B4) and some Unibrace MQB stuff, it should lay flatter in the twisties.
The only thing is, unfortunately, it doesn't seem that VW has a set of drivergear springs out for this generation. The combo of them, the bilsteins ans the H&R sways really made my MK6 a very nimble car despite the mild increases with each one.
As per the tech tab of the GTI and R, they have similar brake sizes, so I suppose it depends on if the halidex rear can on accept R brakes or GTI. I feel this is a much needed upgrade, and helpful that it is OEM.
Same for the turbo, if I do go that route. However, I'd need to ask APR if it affects any of the drive modes.
Oh, and I don't believe any Alltrack comes with DCC,
 
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golfdave

Autocross Champion
Location
Scotland (U.K.)
Car(s)
Mk7 Golf GT Estate
The GSW is a Golf Hatch with 1ft added after the rear axle....the Alltrack is just a trim designation specifying raised ride height, 4WD & black plastic add on scuff protection...

They are all the same car.....& over here in UK we get the GTD hatch which is the powerful 2lt diesel (185PS)...& you can order that same engine in the Alltrack...

so go down that route with the suspension...ie Europe spec 185PS diesel Alltrack

But with a higher ride height you will have more body roll...basic physics...
 

Faceman

Autocross Newbie
Location
Long Island
Car(s)
'17 GSW 4Mo
The only thing is, unfortunately, it doesn't seem that VW has a set of drivergear springs out for this generation. ,

R springs are a good match for the 4Motion GSW and Alltrack.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
 

MonkeyMD

Autocross Champion
Maybe see what this dealer did with their "lift kit"

https://www.hewlettvw.com/VehicleDe...en-Golf_Alltrack-SEL-Georgetown-TX/2919334633

 

sethdude

Pobody's Nerfect.
Location
St Louis
I went from a Mk6 GTI, to a Mk7 Sportwagen SE. Due to problems with my sunroof, I was in a loaner Alltrack SEL for two months. Then went back to a GTI Sport when VW made me a good offer to get out of the Sportwagen. The only thing I miss about the Wagen was the extra cargo space. Everything else about the GTI is so much more engaging, and the Mk7 is a big step up from the 6 in terms of engagement.

What do you like best about your current GTI?
 

XM_Rocks

Autocross Newbie
Location
Austin, TX
The GTI will be due for a timing chain, suspension check/ component replacement and carbon cleaning within the next 10K. It has one rear end accident under its belt, which resulted in a bumper and hatch replacement. It's maybe worth $11K trade in, and the work (at dealership) would probably be around 3K or so. Everything has been done at my dealership, as it is tuner friendly



Are you looking for us to justify your purchase? :D

What makes you think you need a new timing chain at 60k miles? This is abnormal. Chains aren’t an issue normally until higher miles (100k-200k) and it’s the guides that start to make noise.

Walnut blast is $300-$400 at an indie repair facility and even cheaper if you use a reputable shadetree guy. As an example there is a local guy on the Facebook group that did my N54 Walnut Blast for $200.

I also doubt your car is worth that in trade, this seems like a $9k car.

So you have to ask yourself, spend $400 today for the walnut blast and another $1,200 for a timing chain/guide change at a later date at an Indie or spend $20k now for a new car. BTW if you can’t tell, not a big fan of dealer service/repairs on a car out of warranty.

Normally good indie repair shops around here hire away the best talent from dealers.
 

George Ab

Drag Racing Champion
Location
Pacific NW
From a financial point; lay down until the urge goes away. If you want an Alltrack, then just do it. It would be a fun project to modify; however, then you are just adding to the cost of a new car purchase. You could raise your GTI, put a shield to protect the engine like on the Alltrack. Walnut blasting of intakes is not that big of a deal; it is like trying to justify a new car because you need tires. A timing chain should last 200K maybe your are thinking about the belts used in the MK5, but even the belts should go for 100K. Now if you said I likely need a new water pump to justify, I could go for that; however, that could also happen to your Alltrack the day it is out of warranty.
 
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