JB4 Logging, stacking and Map 6 Discussion

jybyrd · Oct 12, 2017

Is there a way to bias the AFR request at all? There are some spots on a couple maps that I would prefer to run richer. Or, would that simply mask a flaw in the map that I should address in a different way?

Diggs24 · Oct 12, 2017

Jay_Heim said:
Is there a way to bias the AFR request at all? There are some spots on a couple maps that I would prefer to run richer. Or, would that simply mask a flaw in the map that I should address in a different way?

You can make it run leaner but not richer. Not that I know of anyway.

jybyrd · Oct 12, 2017

Diggs24 said:
You can make it run leaner but not richer. Not that I know of anyway.

Not sure I can think of a reason to ever make it run leaner.

Elidcom · Oct 12, 2017

Hello
I have golf mk7 gti , catless downpipe , intake , 100 fuel +e85 = e30 , +2 C°
I think , i have a bad boost (dont reach 25psi)
My car running 11.7s 100-200
Are logs ok?
Thank you!)

dub_guy · Oct 12, 2017

At +2C, the air is pretty dense, and you likely don't need the boost.

This link covers that: http://www.golfmk7.com/forums/showpost.php?p=378996&postcount=698

Diggs24 · Oct 12, 2017

Elidcom said:
Hello
I have golf mk7 gti , catless downpipe , intake , 100 fuel +e85 = e30 , +2 C°
I think , i have a bad boost (dont reach 25psi)
My car running 11.7s 100-200
Are logs ok?
Thank you!)

Can you post your log to datazap please? Or enable the target boost? Looks like a map1 log in cold weather.

Also, what gears are these 2? looks like 2nd and 3rd. You won't get full boost in 2nd.

nate704 · Oct 12, 2017

0bLiViOuS said:
I don't check my forums for a day and all this talk of air density haha.

In a nutshell what users are saying about absolute versus additive are correct. Additive will make consistent power basically all year. It uses the stock ECU logic of upping the boost automatically in the heat to compensate for less dense air. This is load based tuning and gives you reliable performance regardless of temp and gives you turbo "a break" in the winter months your could say lol. The only downside I see to this are the guys maxing out their turbo in the winter, and then going to change it in the summer.. to me they should be running absolute. If you're going to be running +7psi in the winter and then turning it down to +4-5psi in the summer, it's no different then just an absolute and losing power in the summer.

Absolute will be faster in the winter and slower in the summer. This is due to air density as users have said. I run this more because it's the old school method and I like it lol. I know regardless of temp, I don't want to push my turbo past Xpsi. It might be adding 10psi in the winter and 0 in the summer (ok maybe not 0 but I'm using extremes for examples). In the sake of turbo longevity, I didn't like when my JB1 peaked at 27-28psi, so I'm not allowing it to hit that on the JB4. I could use additive with boost limit, but then it'll just go to the stock map and I rather target my maximum and I don't have to worry about it reverting. It's all just prefernce though in the end and some cars seem to respond better to one method versus the other. Everyone with me?

Now for some examples. Below are some values on the air MASS. I'm using these values based on some cold weather and warmer weather IATs I've seen:

4500rpm 40F@22psi = 31.34lbs/min
6500rpm 40F@15psi = 36.92lbs/min

4500rpm 100F@25psi = 30.46lbs/min
6500rpm 100F@17psi = 35.19lbs/min

4500rpm 100F@27psi = 31.80lbs/min
6500rpm 100F@18psi = 36.30lbs/min

THe purpose of giving these is to show that although some of the cold weather guys aren't pushing too much boost, you're actually pushing more air than the warm air guys right now, and to get similar performance in warm weather, you'd have to peak pretty high. This is also why some of you might be getting timing issues.

Great write up! Thanks

psychonosspaz · Oct 12, 2017

Digilio86 said:
In the middle of reading this thread but I figured I'd jump in and share a couple logs.

My car is FBO IS38 APR with 3.5 to 3 inch exhaust

This log shows just the apr tune after a long night of ridding around. (Cruiser weekend in Ocean City MD) no meth

Second log is Map 6 (methanol injection ) dialed in after working with George for like a week. Don't have a screen shot of my settings as I'm not at my car right now but I think it's 5000rpm +2 5500rpm +4 6000rpm +3 6500rpm +4 7000rpm +2 stacked on the apr tune. (Road wasn't the smoothest)

Thanks for all the great info guys. Glad to be here!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm debating IS38 and APR tune....impressions?

jybyrd · Oct 12, 2017

psychonosspaz said:
I'm debating IS38 and APR tune....impressions?

Why would you debate IS38, but be concerned with a DP install? One of those is much more reversible than the other.

Elidcom · Oct 12, 2017

Diggs24 said:
Can you post your log to datazap please? Or enable the target boost? Looks like a map1 log in cold weather.

Also, what gears are these 2? looks like 2nd and 3rd. You won't get full boost in 2nd.

It wad 3rd 4th gears

Diggs24 · Oct 12, 2017

Well, you won't be able to hit 25psi at 5k on an IS20 anyways. That's wishful thinking. You won't ever hit anywhere near any of that from 5k on up. You can hit 19psi at 6k with some aggressive settings and higher IATs, but you won't hit anywhere even near 23 at 25C. You need to turn it all way down.

Elidcom · Oct 12, 2017

Diggs24 said:
Well, you won't be able to hit 25psi at 5k on an IS20 anyways. That's wishful thinking. You won't ever hit anywhere near any of that from 5k on up. You can hit 19psi at 6k with some aggressive settings and higher IATs, but you won't hit anywhere even near 23 at 25C. You need to turn it all way down.

What settings of map 6 can u recomend(good boost line)? I need the most aggressive map for racing and checking my 100-200kmh)
Thank you)
Usually i use map 2)

Diggs24 · Oct 12, 2017

Elidcom said:
What settings of map 6 can u recomend(good boost line)? I need the most aggressive map for racing and checking my 100-200kmh)
Thank you)
Usually i use map 2)

Try these (yes they are additive):

https://datazap.me/u/diggs24/log-1502840894?log=0&data=1-3

Also, setup an account on datazap so we can see logs. Those pictures are too hard to look at and don't show all the necessary data (I can see you run lean around 5k).

psychonosspaz · Oct 12, 2017

Jay_Heim said:
Why would you debate IS38, but be concerned with a DP install? One of those is much more reversible than the other.

Eventually.....DP is more immediate thought

George Smooth · Oct 13, 2017

Jay_Heim said:
Not sure I can think of a reason to ever make it run leaner.

There are two train of thought. Some tuners will run it lean till around 5000rpm which helps with spool and midrange power. ED is a good example of this. Others run it in between at high 13's till around 4000 and then drop into the mid to high 12's.

The goal is to run it leanish without triggering the EGT safety. Once the safety is triggered the AFR will run up to 2 points richer. When this happen its normally in higher gears which most people in the US do not experience. If the car is set too rich and it hits the safety it the AFR can become dangerously rich. We have locked the max bias to avoid this but also run it at such a point that the safety is rarely triggered. The operation of the safety is within the normal operating parameters of the ECU and happens relatively often on the stock AFR levels.

JB4 Logging, stacking and Map 6 Discussion

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