IS20.. or Jump to IS38

[Hotwire1]

So, My GSW is still mechanically stock. But I have an IS20 to swap in as soon as I pass the 5000k milage mile stone.

Would it be worth my while to sell the IS20, and just go right to IS38? I mean, will the IS20 leave me wishing for more? thinking that I spent the time and money on an upgrade that I could have netted MUCH MORE with just going to the IS38 right off the bat?

Or, Is the IS20 Maxing out the capabilities of the 1.8 TSI? and the IS38 would not be used to its full capacity? would It be a waste of my time and money trying to make something OVER WHELM the 1.8 TSI where the IS20 would have done just as well?

What is every ones take on this?

 

[dr_mat]

There will always be a faster car... Are you doing it yourself? If so you can afford to experiment a little I would say.


...if it creaks, it's probably made by VAG

 

[Hotwire1]

There will always be a faster car... Are you doing it yourself? If so you can afford to experiment a little I would say.

I am doing it all myself, and with the cost of Good used IS20's and IS38's perhaps trial and error is a good way to look at it. Also, Running a JB4 makes that MUCH easier to tinker with as well.

I see where guys running 1.8 TSI IS38 swaps are getting 350+ HP.. But.. the IS20 is up there in the 320-340 range too. Driving style and other modifications can DRASTICALLY make up for that small difference.

I guess I will have to try the IS20 out first.

AFAIK : the 2.0 and the 1.8 share the same block and some internals. Its the same bore I think too.. So.. finding a 2.0 crank and rods may be a cheap way to bump up too?

 

[dr_mat]

It's torque that you'll feel the most, but the rest of the drivetrain will let go before you reach crazy torque by all accounts. Keep the turbo flowing at high rpms and you'll make bigger power numbers but you'll still be limited to the same torque numbers through the rest of the range. Personally a good balance and wide torque range is better than a huge headline power number.

 

[Hotwire1]

FYI :

1.8 TSI : Bore 82.5mm x Stroke 84.1mm w/ die-forged steel crankshaft with five 58 mm mains

2.0 TSI : Bore 82.5mm by Stroke 92.8mm w/ die-forged steel crankshaft with five 58 mm mains

The HPFP on the 1.8 is only 170 Bar, where as on the 2.0 its 190 Bar. Again, an easy up grade.

So, with a Crank, Rods and HPFP from one of the 2.0 TSI's you can bump your 1.8 up to 2.0 easy.

It looks like there are A LOT more veh. using the 2.0 TSI then the 1.8... Application wise any ways. So, finding these in the wreckers soon will be possible and the parts for the upgrade.. should be cheap too.

 

[Hotwire1]

It's torque that you'll feel the most, but the rest of the drivetrain will let go before you reach crazy torque by all accounts. Keep the turbo flowing at high rpms and you'll make bigger power numbers but you'll still be limited to the same torque numbers through the rest of the range. Personally a good balance and wide torque range is better than a huge headline power number.

I agree 100% its all about the USABLE power, and if you can get it to the ground. Being 4motion.. Traction is less of an issue to me. but could cause MUCH more of a problem when something lets go.

 

[dr_mat]

The 1.8 is not available in most of Europe I think. It's only shipped to the US because in a land of V8s people don't take a 1.4 seriously..


...if it creaks, it's probably made by VAG

 

[BronxBomber]

I think the IS20 will be a better match for the 1.8. 10% less displacement than the 2.0, the spool will be much more palatable with the IS20 than with the IS38. You can notice the lag on 2.0 when going from an IS20 to an IS38. I figure it will be moreso with the smaller 1.8

 

[Jose_Gti]

I think the IS20 will be a better match for the 1.8. 10% less displacement than the 2.0, the spool will be much more palatable with the IS20 than with the IS38. You can notice the lag on 2.0 when going from an IS20 to an IS38. I figure it will be moreso with the smaller 1.8

X2 in this

 

[MeltedSolid]

I don't know what kind of cars you're used to, but I can tell you with confidence that the IS20 swap by no means feels slow or lacking in any way to me. That's not to say you wouldn't feel more (probably a lot more) with an IS38 (and given you have the DSG I don't think there would be significant boost threshold downsides like there probably would be with my 5mt). The dyno graphs and quarter mile times speak for themselves. You have the options of fast, or really fast, and without question it will feel like nothing you thought your car could possibly be capable of.

For me personally, I am not sure if an IS38 would make total sense. I already can't get traction in 2nd, and the 5mt ratios are so long I would probably struggle a lot with slow corners, but for you I don't see any reason aside from cost not to go with an IS38. I think this decision should be up to you and what you want with the car.

 

[joofcorn]

Haven't installed my is20 yet, so take my thoughts witha grain of salt. I would say part of this is what you are looking to get out of more power. The is20 will pull much harder at really low RPMs. You can see this on APR dyno graphs they advertise, the is38 does not catch the is20 torque/hp until almost 3000 rpms. However, obviously the is38 will continue to pull much longer. Also worth noting since you mention the JB4, that it doesn't support the is38 turbo on its own (unless someone wants to correct me on that).

 

[Steenbeek]

I am doing it all myself, and with the cost of Good used IS20's and IS38's perhaps trial and error is a good way to look at it. Also, Running a JB4 makes that MUCH easier to tinker with as well.

I see where guys running 1.8 TSI IS38 swaps are getting 350+ HP.. But.. the IS20 is up there in the 320-340 range too. Driving style and other modifications can DRASTICALLY make up for that small difference.

I guess I will have to try the IS20 out first.

AFAIK : the 2.0 and the 1.8 share the same block and some internals. Its the same bore I think too.. So.. finding a 2.0 crank and rods may be a cheap way to bump up too?

Google for SSP 606, there you'll find all the differences between 1.8 tsi, 2.0 TSI, 2.0 TSI R. It says for example that the 1.8 has 48mm crankshaft bearings whereas the 2.0 has 52mm.
The engine might not be as resistant as the 2.0 but I think as long as you stay below 450Nm (330ft lb) it should be fine.

 

[dr_mat]

Of course, for the ultimate performance you need to get rid of the petrol engine altogether and get Mr Musk to put in a nice electric traction motor and a crap ton of batteries. Bingo, the car can generate exactly 100% of the torque the wheels can actually deliver, at any rpms.


...if it creaks, it's probably made by VAG

 

[carchrism5]

Here is a consideration, the IS20 will spool a little faster but it dies off at the top end, so much so that you are better suited to shift before redline for the best acceleration. The IS38 is a more linear pull all the way to redline.

At first I was going to say since Golfs don't have the sport differential that you should go IS20 because you will just spin, then I looked back and saw you were 4 motion, in that case I say go IS38. Its only a few hundred bucks more.

Also when swapping the turbo you should really do a proper tune, not a JB. JBs are fine for people on a stock car that want something easy and cheap, but when getting into an upgrade as big as swapping a turbo you will yield much better results with a tune.

 

[carchrism5]

Btw forgot to ask, are you upgrading the intercooler and DP? If not the IS38 will be greatly restricted to the point where it’s not worth it.


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